Moving houses, need opinions on floor bracing

[Sasq40]

So I'm moving in a week and trying to get prepared for the fish tank. Its a 2 story house with a 4ft crawl space underneath. The fish tank will be going on an outside wall parallel with the joists. Its a 160 bow front(6x24x24(18 at the edges) The floor is 16 joist so the tank will be sitting on 2 joists. There are 2 support beams 63" from the left side of the tank and 29" from the right side of the tank.

My thoughts are to add 2 floor jacks under the front to corners were the tank would be, with a 24x24 cement block as well as a piece of lumber, probably 4x4 or rough cut 3x12(i have alot from work) to help spread the load over the cement. The crawl space is dirt floor but the water level is quite high right now so doing a footing may be difficult, but not impossible(would have to dig to find out)

Also I'm thinking of moving my sump into the garage, which is probably 8' ft away from the tank, on the rear wall. So i would be routing my plumbing behind the tank, then into the garage(which is sunken about 1' below the living room) Ive been looking at large plastic tanks to use as my sump(id imagine probably best bet would be to get external pump and skimmer) I suppose my main concern is the draining of the tank(right now im corner overflows with 1 & 3/4 bulkheads). Basically as long as my sump is lower then the highest drain point then will it still drain going that long of a run?

I dont plan on having the plumbing done before the move, but i know i need to get the bracing done before the tank goes into place. Any and all help appropriated!!!

[Bri-Guy]

How can you plan to be putting your sump in the garage?
This isn't California. Or will it be room temperature, and not be used otherwise?

[Sasq40]

How can you plan to be putting your sump in the garage?
This isn't California. Or will it be room temperature, and not be used otherwise?

Lol out of all my questions that's the question you ask 😝 I have a heated garage so it's stays nice and warm 😊 may also just build a small 6x10 room for the sump so I can use a open trough instead of a sealed unit

[Frogger]

In order for your tank to drain you need a minimum of 1 to 2% slope over the entire run, there can be no dips or it will clog. A 1" and 3/4" bulkhead will not move much water at a 1% grade.
Increase the grade or increase the size of the bulkhead and increase the amount of water that will move through the line. You can always adjust the size of your return pump to meet the amount of water your drain will move. You do not have to have a large turnover in your sump to make the sump effective.

I am not an engineer but bracing a tank is not a bad idea. You would likely need a footing in to hard pan to work over the long run. A large 2'x2' concrete pad on the soil surface might work for a short period, but could be affected by the changes in soil moisture. You do not want your floor going up and down.

[Scythanith]

Best you could hope for is to add a gate valve to the drain and get it pulling a siphon.

[WarDog]

Could you post a picture of the 2 joists and 2 beams in question? I have a feeling you might be good with just sistering the 2 joists and adding some blocking.

[Sasq40]

Could you post a picture of the 2 joists and 2 beams in question? I have a feeling you might be good with just sistering the 2 joists and adding some blocking.

What's everyone using for posting photos now, I used to use Photobucket but last time I tried posting pics it was paid only. Been a while lol

My current plan is to just get 2 telepost on sidewalk blocks under the joist that the front of the fish tank is on. Joist are 2x10 and roughly 14 ft long

[WarDog]

What's everyone using for posting photos now, I used to use Photobucket but last time I tried posting pics it was paid only. Been a while lol

My current plan is to just get 2 telepost on sidewalk blocks under the joist that the front of the fish tank is on. Joist are 2x10 and roughly 14 ft long

I use Flikr. It's free for up to 1000 photos.

If by 'sidewalk blocks', you mean some type of concrete paver, I wouldn't use that. It will shatter. Instead, place your jacks on top of some wood. It will absorb and distribute weight more evenly. A couple of 2 x 10's @ 12 - 24 inches under each jack will absorb and distribute weight more evenly. A few nails to secure the jacks will also help with any future shear stresses.

[Sasq40]

I use Flikr. It's free for up to 1000 photos.

If by 'sidewalk blocks', you mean some type of concrete paver, I wouldn't use that. It will shatter. Instead, place your jacks on top of some wood. It will absorb and distribute weight more evenly.

I'll post the photo I got from when I was at the house last. The only reason I say side walk block is to just get the wood off the dirt, but now I'm thinking sistering the 2 joist under the tank, maybe a few after, using something like a 4x4 concrete base with a 4x4 and one of those threaded elevated post braces to get it nice and snug

[WarDog]

I'll post the photo I got from when I was at the house last. The only reason I say side walk block is to just get the wood off the dirt, but now I'm thinking sistering the 2 joist under the tank, maybe a few after, using something like a 4x4 concrete base with a 4x4 and one of those threaded elevated post braces to get it nice and snug

IMHO concrete is overkill, and costly. A wood base under the jacks is plenty. You can always place some vapor barrier between the wood and soil.

[Sasq40]

IMHO concrete is overkill, and costly. A wood base under the jacks is plenty. You can always place some vapor barrier between the wood and soil.

I auctally have a few concrete desk posts that I had from a pergola thing I built but took down to move to the new place, so I already have the concrete and 4x4 to make posts. I auctally sent a email to Kevin @ African-cichlid.com and have based my current plan on his suggestions, with some tweaks using material I have on had.

What my current plan is to make another 2x10 beam that will span the center of the room, with 4x4s on cement post bases with a adjustable base on top to make sure my new beam is nice and tight. once this is done I need to move onto the sump system. I plan to run either sumpless till I finish the new setup or my current sump setup if I can save the plumbing.

My goal here is to have as silent of a tank as possible as this will be in our living room

I'm thinking of during a bean animal with pipes coming from behind and use my current corner overflows as the drains. Am I correct in assuming as long as my sump is lower then my lowest drain in will drain?

Next question is what should I use as a sump? I'd prefer to use something that can be closed up as my current plan is to stick it in the corner of my garage, which I use for wood and metal projects so there is often dirt in the air. Another option is for me to build a small room in the garage corner thst will contain the sump equipment. Then I guess I need to figure out what kind of hose / pipe setup will be best

[Ryanerickson]

Total overkill in my opinion but if it helps yeah sleep at night why not.

[Sasq40]

Total overkill in my opinion but if it helps yeah sleep at night why not.

Over kill is better then a wet floor lol, there used to be a big tv stand with doors there and when you walked by the doors would shake,so there's some play there

[Frogger]

Am I correct in assuming as long as my sump is lower then my lowest drain in will drain?

Yes water will always find a level and it will drain if it is lower, however as I stated before when installing drainage you have to maintain a minimum of 1 to 2% over the entire distance. If there are any low points there is the potential for debris accumulating and eventually blocking the line. Blocked line = wet floor. A 1" main line and a 3/4" backup line will not move a lot of water if you only have a 1% grade.

What the distance and we can calculate out the minimum elevation change required?

[Sasq40]

Yes water will always find a level and it will drain if it is lower, however as I stated before when installing drainage you have to maintain a minimum of 1 to 2% over the entire distance. If there are any low points there is the potential for debris accumulating and eventually blocking the line. Blocked line = wet floor. A 1" main line and a 3/4" backup line will not move a lot of water if you only have a 1% grade.

What the distance and we can calculate out the minimum elevation change required?


Let's see if this works
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4891/45768641595_dc102cbdfb_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2cJqfAg)Fish tank layout (https://flic.kr/p/2cJqfAg) by Kael Short (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150282513@N08/), on Flickr

[gregzz4]

If you really want a sump in the garage, a 1' drop and 8' away means you'll need about an 8" drop. More is better. 1/8" per foot is close to code but I prefer to go overkill.
The bottom of your drains need to be, in this case, at least 8" higher than your planned sump. If you can, put your tank on a taller stand.
I was having flow issues with my old setup. In my case, my drain pipes were too small @ 1"
My bulkheads used to be 30" from the floor and now are 40".
I run at least 6' long and use 1-1/2" pipe. Everything has been great for nearly 3 years now.

As for your structural stuff, if you're going to put footings down in the soil, you'll need to dig down at a minimum of 24". 12" is for the footing and another 12" is to clear the frost line. In my opinion it's not worth it. Don't use jacks without a proper concrete footing. It will fail with frost heave if you don't dig it down and pour a proper bed.
Sistering the joists is a good enough plan as you won't get much deflection without them, so I don't see much floor movement once you add material.
Ensure you sister properly. Both sides of each joist need material, and go 100% past your required area.
Use glue and decent screws and leave it alone for a few days to dry.
I'll bet sistering is all you need.

Good luck !!

[Frogger]

One thing to note is if you want a perfectly quiet tank a long somewhat horizontal run could be noisy as there will be air with the water running through the pipes. You may have to insulate the pipes to reduce the noise. You could also build a trap at the other end of the run so that you reduce the air in the pipe, however this could result in clogging and reduction in flow

[gregzz4]

I haven't had any air issues in my drains. Once the air in my lines flushes it's done and dead quiet. And that's running 1-1/2" plumbing with an Eheim 1262.
My return line is 1" and splits into 2 x 3/4" loclines.

My main drain is below the level in the sump(submerged to keep a siphon), and my emerg in above to alert me with splashing noises ... like I'm ever around to hear it :lol:

Once my main flushes itself, it runs dead silent. My tank is surprisingly quiet.
I've worked on things to make it quiet with padding and such.
Anyone who's been here buying corals can tell you, and there's been dozens of peeps.

Anyway ...
Don't worry about drainage noise as long as you set up your drains properly.
We can help you work on that later.

Get your tank in place and we'll work on the other stuff later.

[Sasq40]

I haven't had any air issues in my drains. Once the air in my lines flushes it's done and dead quiet. And that's running 1-1/2" plumbing with an Eheim 1262.
My return line is 1" and splits into 2 x 3/4" loclines.

My main drain is below the level in the sump(submerged to keep a siphon), and my emerg in above to alert me with splashing noises ... like I'm ever around to hear it :lol:

Once my main flushes itself, it runs dead silent. My tank is surprisingly quiet.
I've worked on things to make it quiet with padding and such.
Anyone who's been here buying corals can tell you, and there's been dozens of peeps.

Anyway ...
Don't worry about drainage noise as long as you set up your drains properly.
We can help you work on that later.

Get your tank in place and we'll work on the other stuff later.


Sounds good brother! I was there last night and noticed a poorly repaired cracked joist about 2 from the fish tank, so I'm going to go properly sister that joist tonight and then make my beam with post. The whole room does have bridging in it but I'll feel better with extra bracing

[Sasq40]

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7906/45995459844_7c1d5526ac_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2d5sKKJ)Fish tank support (https://flic.kr/p/2d5sKKJ) by Kael Short (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150282513@N08/), on Flickr

Well got the beefing done yesterday and tank moved today. I'm still a little concerned that when you jump in front of the tank or walk really heavy I see some water movement.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4826/45820519325_1c1e63c6f4_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2cP192T)All moved (https://flic.kr/p/2cP192T) by Kael Short (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150282513@N08/), on Flickr

[Sasq40]

Should I be concerned with the movement of tank? I don't know how much more I can beef up the basement other than pouring a Slab

[Sasq40]

I dropped off another load today and I noticed I can auctally move the stand a bit with my hands, wondering if maybe there's to much underlay under the flooring. I was debating bracing the unit to the wall

[Sasq40]

Well got a call from the inlaws this morning, were buying there house and they haven't got possession of there new one, and looks like the move didn't go well, bunch of fish floating, at this point I'm assuming one of anemone must have died. �� Guess new house new tank, blah one way to get rid of my apistia problem I suppose

[Sidius]

Well got a call from the inlaws this morning, were buying there house and they haven't got possession of there new one, and looks like the move didn't go well, bunch of fish floating, at this point I'm assuming one of anemone must have died. �� Guess new house new tank, blah one way to get rid of my apistia problem I suppose

Sorry to hear about the losses :sad:

[Sasq40]

Sorry to hear about the losses :sad:

Yeah and I guess the smell was so bad the father in law flushed the tank out with fresh water, so I guess no saving the coral. Guess a good time to cook the rock and get my sump figured out

[Sidius]

Yeah and I guess the smell was so bad the father in law flushed the tank out with fresh water, so I guess no saving the coral. Guess a good time to cook the rock and get my sump figured outOh no! That's terrible news. So sorry to hear, again... Did you have lots of coral?

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