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iceman86
04-21-2017, 07:34 PM
Hey guys, maybe someone here can help my figure out this crash. My tank is going through a crash right now. All the fish are fine but I'm losing all my corals (sps and lps). I've a ready lost some large sps colonies and at least a dozen smaller ones and a bunch of frags. My sps started bleaching some from the top, others from the bottom and others from the middle. My lps aren't many (mostly acans) half have died and the others look fine. My Monti caps are even getting random bleaching spots.

I have always used t5 since the beginning of this tank but in January I switched to led to get away from the hassle of changing bulbs. Everything looked great or about a month and then the sps started receding where it was being shadowed. And getting random burn spots. I figured it was the fixture not being full spectrum and not enough spread so 2 weeks and I got rid of that fixture and replaced it new ones that are full spectrum and will cover the tank more so I don't get any shadowing and also added some t5. Things kept going downhill and dying.

300 gallon tank actual water volume
Alk 8
Cal 470
Mag 1320
Po4 0.04
Nitrates undetectable
Potassium 390
Sg 1.025

I've also replaced the cal, mag, and alk kits to confirm my readings.

I was using a doser for years and worked well but I switched to a calcium reactor in January to make things a little easier. At that time I had the parameters dialed in 8 alk 420 cal and 1350 mag. Tested for a couple weeks and held stable so I only tested alk from that point. I tested last week and alk was 8.7 but cal was 490 and mag was 1320. I'm back to dosing to bring the calcium back down before I turn the reactor back on. I just tested at 470 right now.

I've replaced carbon and gfo often, keep filter socks clean and do all the maintenance to keep it clean and nothing changes.

All I can think of is that in January I bought some nori for my tangs from Walmart. I used it for about a week but I didn't like it because it would almost fall apart in the water. I then looked up the ingredients online and there was some oils that they added to it so I went back to feeding my old nori. It almost seems like my skimmer hasn't worked right since then.

Also around January my rodi filters got neglected and the d/I was exhausted. I'm not sure for how long but I'm sure some stuff got through the filters. I've replaced everything since then.

I've also checked for stray voltage and didn't get any.

Only thing I haven't done is a water change due to the large volume of water needed to make a difference.

Any ideas guy?

Craigdillman
04-21-2017, 07:46 PM
Hey man that really sucks

But from what from I'm reading if your fish are ok and it started with corals and your parameters have been stable the only other thing you Changed that was big was the lights, LEDs are a big change from the T5 specially if you haven't been up on changing the bulbs you could have had a massive par swing from like 300- over 1000 some lights are depending what u got and settings and height , i would start there dial back the lights % if you can or shorten the time they are on

Seems your water is good but with death water changes are never a bad thing maybe try doing a few decent % WCs to see if you can turn the tide

Hope that helps man not sure

Animal-Chin
04-21-2017, 09:30 PM
Do you do regular small water changes? I just went through a mini crash (tips burning, some coral expelling all polyps) and it turned out my source water was high on chlorine because my RO filter couldn't handle it and it was passing through.

If you don't do changes do you replenish the trace elements?

It could be a lot of things, can you post a picture of the tank and some examples of whats going on?

MitchM
04-21-2017, 09:37 PM
Sorry to hear, iceman86.
A few questions:
Did you measure the PH before and after the addition of the calcium reactor?
Do you have a sandbed?
What light fixtures were you using and which ones are you now using?
What do you have for water circulation?
How much GFO have you been using and how often are you replenishing it?
How long has the tank in it's present state been running for?
Can you post a link to the Walmart nori?

Please post a picture as mentioned above.
I'm not a fan of GFO because it will remove trace elements, so I would recommend a larger (25%) water change sooner than later.

Bblinks
04-21-2017, 11:17 PM
Can we get some pics of the tank before and after....maybe some close ups?

iceman86
04-21-2017, 11:54 PM
Hey man that really sucks

But from what from I'm reading if your fish are ok and it started with corals and your parameters have been stable the only other thing you Changed that was big was the lights, LEDs are a big change from the T5 specially if you haven't been up on changing the bulbs you could have had a massive par swing from like 300- over 1000 some lights are depending what u got and settings and height , i would start there dial back the lights % if you can or shorten the time they are on

Seems your water is good but with death water changes are never a bad thing maybe try doing a few decent % WCs to see if you can turn the tide

Hope that helps man not sure

Thanks for your help. I changed to led when the t5 where about 9 months old so I can be shock as you mention. If I can't seem to figure it out, I'll do some large water changes to remove anything that may be in the water.

iceman86
04-21-2017, 11:57 PM
Do you do regular small water changes? I just went through a mini crash (tips burning, some coral expelling all polyps) and it turned out my source water was high on chlorine because my RO filter couldn't handle it and it was passing through.

If you don't do changes do you replenish the trace elements?

It could be a lot of things, can you post a picture of the tank and some examples of whats going on?

I hand done a water change in a few months but I do go through a lot of top off water due to evaporation. I was dosing trace elements from aquaforest and didnt have any issues but then I stopped when things started dying.

I'll try to get some pics up for you guys to see

iceman86
04-22-2017, 12:11 AM
Sorry to hear, iceman86.
A few questions:
Did you measure the PH before and after the addition of the calcium reactor?
Do you have a sandbed?
What light fixtures were you using and which ones are you now using?
What do you have for water circulation?
How much GFO have you been using and how often are you replenishing it?
How long has the tank in it's present state been running for?
Can you post a link to the Walmart nori?

Please post a picture as mentioned above.
I'm not a fan of GFO because it will remove trace elements, so I would recommend a larger (25%) water change sooner than later.

My ph before the reactor is 8.3 and with the reactor it did with it it's about 8.2 and would drop to 8-8.1at night.
I also have a ph probe right in the reactor as well measuring a oh of 6.7
Yes I do have a coarse sandbed.
At first I switched from 2 tek t5 fixtures 8 bulb each to 2 vertex illumina fixtures. My latest set are 5 mars aqua fixtures along with 4 36" t5 bulbs.
For water circulation I have 2 maxpect gyres that will blow the sand around if not turned down.
I run 1000 of gfo and that lasts me about 2-3 months. I have 7 tangs who poop a lot lol
This tank itself has been running for about a year but the live stock has been with me for about 5 years while upgrading tanks .
I tried looking earlier on the Walmart page for a pic of the nori but I couldn't find that exact one sorry.

iceman86
04-22-2017, 12:12 AM
It's been a while since I posted a pic. Can anyone give me some instructions ?

Skimmer Juice
04-22-2017, 12:58 AM
Just upload to photobucket and copy and past the img tag

iceman86
04-22-2017, 01:03 AM
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ee2aqau7p0pqgjf/AAAm7KIKQvA_flpOgZdnzSiZa?dl=0

I hope that helps

Ryanerickson
04-22-2017, 01:18 AM
Have you double checked salinity with another refractometer? I've almost wiped out a tank slowly with a broken refractometer, Just a guess. looks like something is irritating everything as even the trumpet coral looks to be receding.

Ryanerickson
04-22-2017, 01:19 AM
Sure hope you figure it out tanks beautiful.

MitchM
04-22-2017, 01:44 AM
Your tank setup looks fine, but your tank has been through a lot of changes in the last 6 months including light changes, changing from dosing to a calcium reactor, alk fluctuations and the use of carbon dosing plus you have a mixture of lps and sps. You didn't mention if you were using activated carbon, so that may be a good idea to compensate for the allelopathy (chemical warfare) between your corals.
Bottom line I think your tank needs some stability, but start with a regular water change schedule.
Turn down the lights and increase water circulation. Water circulation is as important, if not more important than lighting.
imo:smile:

iceman86
04-22-2017, 02:05 AM
Have you double checked salinity with another refractometer? I've almost wiped out a tank slowly with a broken refractometer, Just a guess. looks like something is irritating everything as even the trumpet coral looks to be receding.


I just recalibrated the refractometer and the tank is sitting at 1.024

Bugger
04-22-2017, 03:37 AM
Iceman you said you neglected the RO filters my guess is chorine got into the tank.

vanreefer
04-22-2017, 03:43 AM
Iceman you said you neglected the RO filters my guess is chorine got into the tank.

Just what I was thinking... How aggressively were u dosing AF? And what products?

iceman86
04-22-2017, 07:57 PM
Just what I was thinking... How aggressively were u dosing AF? And what products?

I was dosing aquaforest reef salt
aquaforest calcium
Aquaforest magnesium
Aquafores component strong
Aquaforest reef mineral salt
Aquaforest amino acids
Aquaforest bacteria

I followed the directions for all of them and never had an issue before.

vanreefer
04-22-2017, 08:37 PM
Was using the same things at full ( recommended) doses... Had a similar issue which resulted in the loss of all my sps... i think the corals got stressed and stopped using all the micro elements which then built up to toxic levels. Tank is recovering now... I think I will start at 10% of recommended doses...
I would encourage u to do as large a water change as is possible... I did 4 50g changes... Water volume is ~220g

dcw1sfu
04-23-2017, 02:18 AM
Are you carbon dosing at all. I almost wiped my tank with a nopox overdose and experienced losses in the same manner you describe.

Myka
04-23-2017, 07:10 PM
Your tank setup looks fine, but your tank has been through a lot of changes in the last 6 months including light changes, changing from dosing to a calcium reactor, alk fluctuations and the use of carbon dosing plus you have a mixture of lps and sps. You didn't mention if you were using activated carbon, so that may be a good idea to compensate for the allelopathy (chemical warfare) between your corals.
Bottom line I think your tank needs some stability, but start with a regular water change schedule.
Turn down the lights and increase water circulation. Water circulation is as important, if not more important than lighting.
imo:smile:

I totally agree with this! :)

I think the issues you're seeing is from the wild fluctuations in the tank and all the changes made. Get it stable for at least 4 weeks, then add a new coral to "test the water". Chances are that what you're seeing is damage from the past, rather than current conditions.

iceman86
04-24-2017, 12:48 AM
Are you carbon dosing at all. I almost wiped my tank with a nopox overdose and experienced losses in the same manner you describe.

No I'm not carbon dosing. I've ran it on previous tanks with great success but I tried to get away from it on this tank.

iceman86
04-24-2017, 01:11 AM
I lowered my led intensity a bit as well because I've noticed that the couple chalices I have are starting to get a little pale. Should I do a large water change just in case it's something in the water?

Frogger
04-24-2017, 01:41 AM
If the issue with your tank is stability associated with all the changes that have happened how is a large water change going to help with stability. You might be better with many smaller water changes.

Myka
04-24-2017, 03:34 AM
If the issue with your tank is stability associated with all the changes that have happened how is a large water change going to help with stability. You might be better with many smaller water changes.
I don't think a large water change is a good idea.

iceman86
04-24-2017, 03:39 AM
Ok I'll let it roll for a few weeks and see how it goes. Parameters are perfectly steady so fingers crossed!!

Thanks for the help everyone!

Myka
04-24-2017, 04:56 AM
Ok I'll let it roll for a few weeks and see how it goes. Parameters are perfectly steady so fingers crossed!!

Thanks for the help everyone!

That's the trickiest part! Keeping the numbers steady for weeks and months at a time. When the numbers are steady for a long time we get lax on testing/monitoring and we do stupid things like let a doser run out of fluid or don't test for a month and find out that growth has taken off or even tapered off and KH is at 5 or 12 dKH. Ugh. :lol:

Two months ago I accidentally turned the doser off on my own tank, and didn't notice until I could see the corals reacting to low KH. The KH hit 5.7-5.85 dKH (depending which test you believe), and the damage was already done. The first thing I did was turn the T5s down by 50%, then I corrected the KH by taking a week to slowly bring it back up, and then I sat back and waited for the apocalypse. https://www.reef2reef.com/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Xenforo%20Extended%20Smilies%201k/shifty.png After about 3 weeks I started seeing the affects. It takes quite awhile to see the affects - usually just when you start to think you're in the clear. Now two months later the Acros still aren't back to where they were - maybe another month.

tang daddy
04-26-2017, 04:28 PM
How long has your tank been set up?

When did you introduce the acros or they grew from frags?

Doesn't look like a lot of rock in the display, could this be happening because of a lack of nutrients/bacteria?

If they only started dying when you changed your t5 to led it is a possibility that it was the light but even usually if it's the light it takes a bit of time i.e. Bleaching, stn.

Did you check to see if predatation is a factor?

iceman86
04-26-2017, 09:23 PM
How long has your tank been set up?

When did you introduce the acros or they grew from frags?

Doesn't look like a lot of rock in the display, could this be happening because of a lack of nutrients/bacteria?

If they only started dying when you changed your t5 to led it is a possibility that it was the light but even usually if it's the light it takes a bit of time i.e. Bleaching, stn.

Did you check to see if predatation is a factor?

I've had some of these acros for about 5 years. I grew them out from frags and have been in this tank for almost a year. They have been happy up until recently.

I've never really had nutrients issues and I do feed lots so I don't think that's where the problem is coming from. I also was adding amino acids. I was also adding bacteria 2x per week.

I have also looked for bugs on them and I can't find anything. It's been a while since I've added any new corals.

iceman86
04-26-2017, 09:28 PM
I was sitting at work this morning and thinking about this lol I then realized that I added a clown tang around that sane time the problems started happening. The tang was fat when I bought him, but slowly got skinnier and skinnier even though I was feeding him a ton to try to fatten him up. He ended up dying 2 weeks ago. Found his skeleton on the sand bed. All my other fish and tang are healthy and happy.
Could it be that this fish brought in a coral killing disease?

Animal-Chin
04-26-2017, 10:29 PM
are coral still dying or have things mellowed out?

I wish there were easy answers to this sort of thing. When I started carbon dosing I lost a lot of acro which was maddening because my nitrate was at 80 and they were doing fine and it was during the nitrate drop they started dying off. Now I have a nitrate and algae free tank but lot a lot.

I still think carbon dosing isn't an awesome idea even though I run a reactor. My nitrates/phosphates are super low but I loose sps coral here and there.

I have a huge red planet, the healtyiest looking coral in my tank. 4 days ago one branch turns totally white. I snap it off and the next day another. Every day one little branch (or nub as I call them) dies.

Why? NO idea. Why are all my other coral fine? NO idea. I just keep trimming and hope it stops.

What i should do is reduce my bio load (I have a bunch of big ole fish) and maintain my tank the old way, water changes, but I love my fish so I'm trying to combat their load with a reactor and I'm thinking the consequence is some sps loss.

Sorry just thinking out loud here. Maybe something rings true to your tank?

Frogger
04-26-2017, 11:03 PM
are coral still dying or have things mellowed out?

I wish there were easy answers to this sort of thing. When I started carbon dosing I lost a lot of acro which was maddening because my nitrate was at 80 and they were doing fine and it was during the nitrate drop they started dying off. Now I have a nitrate and algae free tank but lot a lot.

I still think carbon dosing isn't an awesome idea even though I run a reactor. My nitrates/phosphates are super low but I loose sps coral here and there.

I have a huge red planet, the healtyiest looking coral in my tank. 4 days ago one branch turns totally white. I snap it off and the next day another. Every day one little branch (or nub as I call them) dies.

Why? NO idea. Why are all my other coral fine? NO idea. I just keep trimming and hope it stops.

What i should do is reduce my bio load (I have a bunch of big ole fish) and maintain my tank the old way, water changes, but I love my fish so I'm trying to combat their load with a reactor and I'm thinking the consequence is some sps loss.

Sorry just thinking out loud here. Maybe something rings true to your tank?

You should probably start you own thread so we can help you address your problems.

Frogger
04-26-2017, 11:07 PM
I was sitting at work this morning and thinking about this lol I then realized that I added a clown tang around that sane time the problems started happening. The tang was fat when I bought him, but slowly got skinnier and skinnier even though I was feeding him a ton to try to fatten him up. He ended up dying 2 weeks ago. Found his skeleton on the sand bed. All my other fish and tang are healthy and happy.
Could it be that this fish brought in a coral killing disease?

I am not aware of any disease problems that a fish can cause to your corals. I believe a large dead fish could cause a spike in your ammonia levels.

Animal-Chin
04-26-2017, 11:09 PM
my problem is I started a reef tank...:lol:

iceman86
04-26-2017, 11:14 PM
I am not aware of any disease problems that a fish can cause to your corals. I believe a large dead fish could cause a spike in your ammonia levels.

I fed the fish the night before and that tang looked a little sluggish but still ate but next day after work I went to feed again and all that was left was his skeleton. He was gobbled up pretty quick.

tang daddy
04-27-2017, 12:30 AM
It's gotta be something else than the fish....

When I neglected my tank for 5 months I basically let it run to shit, and it was a chain reaction acros went then Lps and finally I told friends to come save the rest and gave the tank away. However it took a really long time for the tank to be in a death state.

Maybe you added something that was toxic, stray voltage, sudden rise in temp, not enough oxygen, or maybe the bacteria died caused a huge spike that stressed the corals to the point they released skin....

Just thinking out loud

iceman86
04-27-2017, 01:07 PM
Got home last night and went to the basement where my tank is and it smelled terrible like something was rotting and sure enough it was coming from the tank. Im guessing hydrogen sulphide releasing from the sand bed. My sandbed is only 2" thick but its really coarse sand and easy for detritus to trap itself in there. All fish and inverts are alive. The glass was also covered in green dust algae.

I'm guessing the sand bed needs replacing? I poked a couple spot and detritus like dust come out. I know it's normal to have a little but this seems more than I've ever had in my years of reefing.

DKoKoMan
04-27-2017, 05:47 PM
Did you start with live rock or dead rock. I don't think it should be releasing that kind of odour from the sand bed. If I had to guess I would think there is some sort of contaminant(s) in your water.

iceman86
04-27-2017, 09:06 PM
Did you start with live rock or dead rock. I don't think it should be releasing that kind of odour from the sand bed. If I had to guess I would think there is some sort of contaminant(s) in your water.

I started with both. I used the old rock from my old tank and added new dead rock. It's getting to the point that all my corals are dead and if it happens, I'll siphon out the sanded and do a massive water change and start over

DKoKoMan
04-27-2017, 10:30 PM
I would take your water in to a LFS in Edmonton and have them do a massive test. This way you can compare to previous tests you have done. Worth a shot IMO, sucks to hear that most of the corals are toast.

MitchM
04-28-2017, 01:11 AM
A few years ago I posted a link to a study done that demonstrated corals are more resiliant when raised in an environment that had varying temperature.
The takeaway from the study was that corals need to be raised in varying conditions from the start if they are to survive varying conditions in the future.
Established corals raised in tight parameters did not survive when subjected to the new varying conditions.

One of the consequenses of aquarists trying to maintain long term success with corals by maintaining rock steady lighting, water chemistry and temperature is that when corals raised in a steady environment are subject to changes in those parameters, the corals are not strong enough to survive those changes.

In nature, corals are subject to environmental changes including lighting, salinity and temperature.
Our commitment to keeping corals within tight parameters produces fragile corals.

The best you can do for your corals is learn what conditions they were kept in previously and don't let your tank conditions wander too far from those conditions.
It's neither easy nor simple to do.

MitchM
04-28-2017, 01:23 AM
Here's a link to the study:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1744-7410.2010.00199.x/abstract

The title of the study is "Effect of fluctuating thermal regime on adult and larval reef corals" Putnam 2010 Invertebrate Biology


And a free article from Dr. Shimek on the subject:
http://www.ronshimek.com/salinity_temperature.html

.

Myka
04-28-2017, 02:42 PM
A few years ago I posted a link to a study done that demonstrated corals are more resiliant when raised in an environment that had varying temperature.
The takeaway from the study was that corals need to be raised in varying conditions from the start if they are to survive varying conditions in the future.
Established corals raised in tight parameters did not survive when subjected to the new varying conditions.

I've definitely noticed this over the years. My old 90-gallon reef with halides over it used to fluctuate from 79-80F at night to 84-85F during the day. It did great. Would it have done better if I tightened up that temperature swing and kept the peak lower? Probably. However, the corals were very resilient. :D

I think this also true of other parameter swings too, such as KH.

MitchM
04-28-2017, 03:47 PM
It's frustrating when you check all parameters which check out fine, but your corals are still dying.
I think reviewing the past conditions that the corals have been exposed to is more important than what the current conditions are.

Sometimes of course, changes are too great for even strong corals to withstand.
Think of what's currently happening to the Great Barrier Reef.

iceman86
04-28-2017, 04:35 PM
Here's a link to the study:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1744-7410.2010.00199.x/abstract

The title of the study is "Effect of fluctuating thermal regime on adult and larval reef corals" Putnam 2010 Invertebrate Biology


And a free article from Dr. Shimek on the subject:
http://www.ronshimek.com/salinity_temperature.html

.

Good info. Thank you

iceman86
04-28-2017, 04:44 PM
It's frustrating when you check all parameters which check out fine, but your corals are still dying.
I think reviewing the past conditions that the corals have been exposed to is more important than what the current conditions are.

Sometimes of course, changes are too great for even strong corals to withstand.
Think of what's currently happening to the Great Barrier Reef.

Thing is, I haven't really changed the parameters too much. They went up slightly but that was over the course of weeks so it shouldn't have bothers them right? Only real drastic change was the t5 to led but that shouldn't kill every coral in the tank.

I'm still thinking it's the sand bed that's releasing hydrogen sulfide because of the smell. I decided to remove half of my sand bed last night and the water and smell was disgusting. I'll post a pic later for you guys. I'm mixing more water right now to remove the rest of it.

tang daddy
04-28-2017, 06:44 PM
Not the best move to remove your sand bed when the tank is recovering from a crash, next time have your water ready so you can do a large wc at the same time, people usually skim the top layer when removing their sand bed 1/2" at a time...

iceman86
04-28-2017, 08:40 PM
Not the best move to remove your sand bed when the tank is recovering from a crash, next time have your water ready so you can do a large wc at the same time, people usually skim the top layer when removing their sand bed 1/2" at a time...

I don't have much else to lose l'm down to a few spa frags now lol. I syphoned out my sand while I did a 50 gallon water change. Matched all parameters in the tank before I did the change.

I checked it out this morning and everything looked ok. First morning I didn't find anything dead. Fingers crossed!

MitchM
04-28-2017, 10:28 PM
Thing is, I haven't really changed the parameters too much. They went up slightly but that was over the course of weeks so it shouldn't have bothers them right? Only real drastic change was the t5 to led but that shouldn't kill every coral in the tank.

I'm still thinking it's the sand bed that's releasing hydrogen sulfide because of the smell. I decided to remove half of my sand bed last night and the water and smell was disgusting. I'll post a pic later for you guys. I'm mixing more water right now to remove the rest of it.

Your corals look to be a large size, so maybe think of what conditions they were kept before this new tank setup.
H2S can be removed from the water with activated carbon or by oxidizing with ozone. Hach makes a kit for measuring H2S, but it's best of course to reduce sediment buildup in the first place.
H2S is deadly to aquatic animals as much as carbon monoxide is deadly to humans. It doesn't take much to be fatal.
Good luck!

DKoKoMan
04-29-2017, 01:28 AM
When you do your WC, do you typically siphon the sand bed on a regular basis? Maybe I missed it but how often and how much of a WC do you do?

Myka
04-29-2017, 03:18 AM
Good luck. You're probably right that you don't have much to lose at this point. Hopefully the removal will help turn things round for you.

people usually skim the top layer when removing their sand bed 1/2" at a time...

I wouldn't do it that way. Exposing deeper layers is the opposite of what you want to do. When I remove a sand bed I remove the entire depth of sand from say 1/4 of the tank, then replace that area with new sand, then next week remove the next 1/4 and replace, and so on.

iceman86
04-29-2017, 05:44 AM
When you do your WC, do you typically siphon the sand bed on a regular basis? Maybe I missed it but how often and how much of a WC do you do?

I do 2-3 water changes per year and each one about 150 gallons. I do syphon the sand to get rid of any detritus in there. My last water change was October but I dose cal alk mag and trace elements. Then a big water change to "rebalnce" the trace elements.

iceman86
04-29-2017, 05:46 AM
Good luck. You're probably right that you don't have much to lose at this point. Hopefully the removal will help turn things round for you.



I wouldn't do it that way. Exposing deeper layers is the opposite of what you want to do. When I remove a sand bed I remove the entire depth of sand from say 1/4 of the tank, then replace that area with new sand, then next week remove the next 1/4 and replace, and so on.

I did another water change this morning and ended up siphoning out the rest of the sand. I checked up on the tank a couple hours ago and everything looks good. The trumpet corals were more open and overall the Lps looked happier.

Myka
04-29-2017, 03:07 PM
I do 2-3 water changes per year and each one about 150 gallons. I do syphon the sand to get rid of any detritus in there. My last water change was October but I dose cal alk mag and trace elements. Then a big water change to "rebalnce" the trace elements.

Maybe this is a sign that your current approach is not working. Lots of people do these minimal or zero water change methods successfully. You may be missing some key point. Have you thought of doing a Triton test when you're some months into no WC? Which salt mix do you use?

iceman86
04-29-2017, 04:27 PM
Maybe this is a sign that your current approach is not working. Lots of people do these minimal or zero water change methods successfully. You may be missing some key point. Have you thought of doing a Triton test when you're some months into no WC? Which salt mix do you use?

Maybe a triton test might be a good idea. I didn't even think about that. I'm going to see if removing the sand helps, if not I guess my next step would be a triton test.

When I initially setup the tank I used h2oceans and then over the summer I switched to aquaforest.

This morning the tank looks stable again. No new die off and the water is incredibly clear. It's had a little bit of cloudy water for a few months. I just couldn't get it this clear even with all the filtration and filter socks, there was always a slight cloudiness to the water.

shiftline
04-29-2017, 05:29 PM
Is there somewhere who does the triton test within Canada?


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iceman86
04-30-2017, 07:04 AM
Is there somewhere who does the triton test within Canada?


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One of the LFS sells the kits so I'd imagine he has some method of getting them sent In.

shiftline
04-30-2017, 07:07 AM
How much are they? I have been curious about doing it


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iceman86
04-30-2017, 07:13 AM
How much are they? I have been curious about doing it


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I have no idea at all but it's a pretty cool method of testing.

If you want more info, his website is https://www.marineexperience.ca his name is Neil.

Myka
05-01-2017, 12:54 AM
Is there somewhere who does the triton test within Canada?


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Most LFS have the packs you can buy for sampling which gives you a sample number and labels then you send them to an address in the USA. It's about $60 for the sampling pack, then postage to USA. You get your results online in about 3 weeks.

iceman86
05-07-2017, 05:14 PM
Hey fellows it's been a week now since I took out my sandbed and everything looks stable again. I Haven't had any losses since then or tissue loss and the corals are opening up nicely again and coraline algae has been growing quite a bit. Some of my corals which I thought were dead are actually showing little bits of colour on some branches as well so I might be able to save them.

I can't really pin point the loss on anything other than my sandbed. The water was quite dirty in the bin that I siphoned all the sand and detritus into but I dont think it could have been the detritus traped in the sandbed that caused this because my ammonia nitrites nitrates phosphates alays came up as 0.

All i can think of is if the power heads were blowing the sand around which caused hydrogen sulfide to slowly release into the water? I think carbon neutralizes the hydrogen sulfide but maybe it was a steady slow release? I'm stumped...

This barebottom thing takes some getting used to but I think it's growing on me :mrgreen:

Thank you everyone for your help!

MitchM
05-07-2017, 07:38 PM
Glad to hear things are improving.
One thing to keep in mind, depending on how old your live rock is, it could be contributing an extra amount to your detritus buildup through a process called bacterial turgor.
Basically, turgor is when the pressure builds up in bacterial cell walls and forces waste products out.
The bacteria in the top few millimeters of your live rock could just be cleaning out the old live rock.