Can I get away with an internal pump?

[GQsmooth]

Looking at pump options for my 220G, with 1.5" outlet return into 3/4" locline (2 exits). The overflow can handle around 2500GPH, and the head is around 12ft vertical. I will be using spa flex to avoid extra head loss, in which I think I will be able to get to the tank basically with 1 straight line except for splitting the lines into 2.

I was looking at the Jebao 15000, but I'm thinking it won't have enough juice to get to the tank with the GPH I need. I'm trying to avoid going external if possible.

What you guys think? And what's the ideal GPH for the pump at the tank? 5-10x? I will also be running Ecotech MP40's to help with flow.

[SoloSK71]

10x turnover through the sump is recommended.

At 12' (4m) this pump won't be able to do much more than 900g or so an hour.

The Syncra HF 16.0, Reef Octopus Water Blaster 16000 or Deepwater Aquatics BLDC15 can provide that kind of flow at that height.

Charles

[Myka]

I prefer 3-5x turnover through the sump since the skimmer can't process more than that anyway, and high flow risks microbubbles in the display. I've used Quiet One 6000 on tanks that size, but at 5 ft head, not 12. I imagine you'll be looking at a DC pump to get the flow needed at 12 ft.

[Potatohead]

For AC pumps a mag24 will do about 1000 gph at that head, but it uses 265 watts (lol) and likely sounds like a truck is always driving by when you're upstairs.

I'd probably go with an L1 (USA only for some reason) or a Waveline 12000. Of course if you run external you could do an Iwaki or something and not touch it for next to forever.

[Galizio]

+1 on myka 3-5x turnover and adjust that with your skimmer intake....
I use a waveline and is quiet but makes a little noise, I heard that ecotech and vertex pumps are super quiet...


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[GQsmooth]

10x turnover through the sump is recommended.

At 12' (4m) this pump won't be able to do much more than 900g or so an hour.

The Syncra HF 16.0, Reef Octopus Water Blaster 16000 or Deepwater Aquatics BLDC15 can provide that kind of flow at that height.

Charles

Yeah, I was looking at the Deepwater Aquatics one as well, seems to be the most efficient for that size.

+1 on myka 3-5x turnover and adjust that with your skimmer intake....
I use a waveline and is quiet but makes a little noise, I heard that ecotech and vertex pumps are super quiet...


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L1 won't be able to pump that head height.

[Potatohead]

Yeah, I was looking at the Deepwater Aquatics one as well, seems to be the most efficient for that size.



L1 won't be able to pump that head height.

You sure you're not thinking of the M1? According to this link the L1 will do 8-900 gph at 12' which is a good number for your tank size.

http://ecotechmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Vectra_Information_Packet.pdf

[Myka]

Another thing to consider, you could install your sump on a platform and raise it off the floor 4-5 feet and still have lots of room to play in it (assuming 8' ceilings) which may be the difference between using an internal and external. Just make sure you design it so that you still have easy access to the sump.

[Reef Pilot]

The Sedra 20000 is an excellent pump for high head pressure, much better than the Mag pumps (which I have also tried). I have had one in my basement sump, pumping upstairs to my main display running for 6+ years with no problems.
http://www.jlaquatics.com/dry-goods/aquarium-supplies/water-pumps-parts/sedra-water-pumps/sedra-ksp-20000-water-pump.html
They put it on sale sometimes.

It actually runs two tanks (another one downstairs) as well as a couple reactors, all off a set of Ts in the sump. And always starts reliably after a power outage (unlike the mags).

[GQsmooth]

You sure you're not thinking of the M1? According to this link the L1 will do 8-900 gph at 12' which is a good number for your tank size.

http://ecotechmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Vectra_Information_Packet.pdf

You sure? 1100 gph is around 5x and that's bare minimum. It's really on the edge. I don't think it would work.



Another thing to consider, you could install your sump on a platform and raise it off the floor 4-5 feet and still have lots of room to play in it (assuming 8' ceilings) which may be the difference between using an internal and external. Just make sure you design it so that you still have easy access to the sump.

Yes, it's on a 40" stand already.

The Sedra 20000 is an excellent pump for high head pressure, much better than the Mag pumps (which I have also tried). I have had one in my basement sump, pumping upstairs to my main display running for 6+ years with no problems.
http://www.jlaquatics.com/dry-goods/aquarium-supplies/water-pumps-parts/sedra-water-pumps/sedra-ksp-20000-water-pump.html
They put it on sale sometimes.

It actually runs two tanks (another one downstairs) as well as a couple reactors, all off a set of Ts in the sump. And always starts reliably after a power outage (unlike the mags).

Looks decent, a little power hungry though.

[Potatohead]

You sure? 1100 gph is around 5x and that's bare minimum. It's really on the edge. I don't think it would work

I usually shoot for 4-5x, more than that is fine but it might be a little bit of old school thinking. I don't know if it really matters, if water goes through the sump twice as fast but is only skimmed or goes through reactors half as much each time, it's the same end result either way. Higher turnover does put more through your filter socks though.

[SoloSK71]

Some of the newer 'systems' suggest higher sump turnover, Triton, Zeovit, not sure why.

Charles

[Myka]

You sure? 1100 gph is around 5x and that's bare minimum. It's really on the edge. I don't think it would work.

Yes, it's on a 40" stand already.

Bummer it's already on a stand!

I'd be happy with 1100 gph on your tank. I wouldn't call it bare minimum at all. Are you doing a full siphon drain like Herbie or Bean? If so, you don't want to tee the pump off for anything else anyway.

[GQsmooth]

Bummer it's already on a stand!

I'd be happy with 1100 gph on your tank. I wouldn't call it bare minimum at all. Are you doing a full siphon drain like Herbie or Bean? If so, you don't want to tee the pump off for anything else anyway.

It will be a bean setup

[DKoKoMan]

Have you looked into the Jebao DC return pumps. I have been looking at them for my 150g build.

[daplatapus]

I've been running my basement sump now for almost 6 years, here's the pumps I've tried:
Pump 1 - Laguna Max flo 2900 pond pump - First SW tank I ever set up. Ran my 90 gallon with about 10' of head no problem - had to deal with a bit of vibration
Pump 2 - Added another tank to the system and wanted a common sump. Went to an external Reeflo Hammerhead. Also ran really well, also had vibration issues, but that was a fairly minor fix
Pump 3 - Upgraded the 2 tanks to a single 210 gallon - built the DT stand a bit higher and moved the sump into a dedicated sump room. Ended up with closer to 13' of head and over 30' horizontal run by the time it was all done. Ordered 2 RLSS Waveline 12000's - Worst money I ever spent and even worse customer service - these pumps DO NOT WORK AS STATED on high head systems. Got so ticked off to get ANY flow, I had to throw my original Laguna Max Flo 2900 (which I still had sitting around as a back up) onto the system and it is still running to this day. Never replaced any impellers, seals or anything yet! But I'm a bit of a flow hog so I purchased another one and have 2 running side by side. Each pump supplies separate piping - one to the front of the tank, the other to the back.