Time to Admit I'm a Bonehead

[AJ_77]

I made a mistake.

On Saturday I bought a Regal Angelfish, and have yet to see it eat in my tank. Even though there is a necessary period of adjustment, I am startled by the shyness of this fish. Nothing like the angels I kept in the past - not even as spunky as a dwarf angel, not even close. So calm, the Naso doesn't even have to show it agression, just shadow him to keep him spooked.

I've tried a few different things to get him to eat. I don't think that he will. My tank isn't the nice peaceful place he needs, and I screwed up to put him here. I don't want to have to resort to drastic measures, because even if I could force food down his gullet, his personality means that's probably all the food he'll get.

If anyone locally has a previous interest in this beautiful fish, and is prepared for one, you should PM me now. Thanks - here's a picture of one, mine is near identical and about 4" in the body:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/images/aug2002/regal2-web.jpg

[Beverly]

On Saturday I bought a Regal Tang, and have yet to see it eat in my tank. Even though there is a necessary period of adjustment, I am startled by the shyness of this fish.

Alan,

We brought home a 4" CBB last Saturday. It, too, has been very shy, hid a lot in the rockwork, and was not interacting with the other fish (none of which have harrassed it at all). It was not eating very much at feeding time, though I have seen it pick a few things off the rock here and there.

Well, today, I decided to stand at the tank at eye level with it where it hid in the rockwork and talk to it :biggrin: You know, to get it used to my voice and to my physical presence. Slowly, it came toward me, flashed me, then swam back to its hiding place. Wow, I thought, and kept talking to it. After 10 minutes of talking, the fish was coming and going from its hiding place quite easily. Chris was so impressed that he began talking to it as well.

Just before lights out, a few minutes ago, we saw the CBB out and about swimming with the other fish, which it had never done before :cool: I don't know what it will do tomorrow at feeding time, but I'm going to talk to it some more before adding the food bit by bit - my usual way of feeding that tank. I have a funny feeling the fish will need more time to get used to its new home and to the feeding times. Plus, I'm going to keep talking to it until it is a well adjusted member of the fish community.

Don't know if talking to fish helps them get used to their new environment, but it didn't hurt in my case :smile: Oh, and you gotta keep telling it how beautiful it is :biggrin:

[AJ_77]

Well that is something I hadn't considered! I've once or twice called Deb "the Tang Whisperer" but that's about it... :smile:

Maybe I'll try it. How do I tell my obnoxious Naso tang to not be such a Naso? I planned this to be an active environment - then put in the Regal anyways, thinking that somehow it would "just work out."

Frustrating thing is, I'm making dumb newbie mistakes.

[Canadian Man]

Hey Alan.
I don't know if this will help or not but here it goes.

When I added my Clown Tang a few weeks ago I experienced similar behavior. My Coral beauty chased him around relentlessly and would not stop. The Clown would only hide and not come out more than to take a peek. Keep in mind I have 3 other tangs in my tank.

Well after about 2 days he started to swim around with the other tangs. The coral beauty would still dart toward him and he would go and hide again for a few minutes. By the 3rd and 4th day the Clown tang was swimming with the other tangs and faced the coral beauty every time he came close. Now he's just another fish in the tank.

[mr_alberta]

That is one beautiful angelfish.

[AJ_77]

That is one beautiful angelfish.
I agree, that's what snagged me... like a fish on a hook.

Anyways, I put him into the 29gal tonight so I can watch closer and get some food to him easier. Much quieter in there. Only tiny fishes... :rolleyes:

[mr_alberta]

Too bad my new tank isn't anywhere near ready yet or I'd take him in a heartbeat.

[Quinn]

I think we're all entitled to one foolish spur-of-the-moment purchase. A lesson for others I suppose. Hopefully you/someone will get lucky and this guy will become another of the many fantastic adult fish that have gone on to almost iconic status on this board. :cool:

[danny zubot]

I've made several mistakes in buying livestock. For me learning the hard way is a way of life. The difference is that now I have enough experience to know when I have failed, and when lucky, remedy the situation. ie: the whole lionfish thing. :confused: I think that Angel is too large for my 54g tank otherwise he'd be mine. What do you think Alan?

[MitchM]

What about partioning off your big tank with some eggcrate for a while? If you're unable to do that, or otherwise run out of options, I'll be happy to put him up over here at my place and either purchase him from you or keep him fat until you're ready to take him back. :smile:

(BTW, you're anything but a bonehead.... :wink:)

Mitch

[Delphinus]

He's really quite a beautiful fish. :cool: Good luck. I'm sure he's just still adjusting, maybe just needs a little more time.

Are the 29g tankmates reasonably peaceable?

[AJ_77]

Mitch - thanks for the cool offer. I really need to see him eat something before I do anything. Darn- eggcrate! Does this work?? It's strictly short-term, though - right? Still 2 torpedo tangs in there when I remove it...

Tony - just 2 wee fish in the 29, one of which he knows from the LFS (they were together). Pretty calm.

[Cap'n]

How do I tell my obnoxious Naso tang to not be such a Naso?

I knew this fish was a mistake the moment you started cursing your beloved blonde.

[AJ_77]

Tim - Yeah, funny huh? You know me too well...

Bob - in the other thread you asked how to force-feed a fish. I followed Kyle's instructions from the old Moo-Idol thread, about finicky feeders and such. Never thought I would be doing it myself, but he ain't eating and I ain't watching him die without trying something fairly desperate.

Basically I put him into a shallow tupperware container, held him with a latex-gloved hand (gently but firmly) so he could still breathe but not thrash about, and pried the syringe end as gently as I could into his mouth. This was very tricky, and I almost shat myself. Plus you don't really know how far to probe so I was hesitant, but got a squirt down him nonetheless. I used a mixture of seafood, mysis and garlic mush. Was told to use yogurt in the mix too, but thought I might puke...

After that, I laid him back in the tak and he swam away. Seems much the same, but looking at me a little differently now. He is a little red around the mouth, and was working the jaw a bit after release. But I didn't see him barf it up, so I'm hopeful.

Off I go! Prayers, please! :biggrin:

[AJ_77]

Ok, so nobody prayed... :confused: BUT, he definitely had more spunk this time - tougher to catch, fought the syringe, and SPIT out the food, little bugger...

We'll see if tomorrow he at least remembers the taste of it, and gets some of the multiple feedings. Or I will net him again... man, what a life. When I look at him I can almost hear him, "How did I get here? Where the HELL is my ocean?!?"

:neutral:

[BMW Rider]

Man, if someone did that to me, I'd agree to eat just to not have to have it done to me again :eek:

I sure hope you can get him eating on his own. I have never had a fish not eat, but have had to watch one get sick with ich and nearly die (my poor old yellow tang- you've seen him) :sad: Its tough. Hopefully the force feeding will get him going on regular food.

[Delphinus]

Wow. :eek: Good luck!!!!

[danny zubot]

Thats a lot of work! That is what we do though, and what else could a person do on a Tuesday evening anyway. :smile:

[AJ_77]

Fish is dead. :sad:

[christyf5]

Sorry to hear that Alan :frown:

[Delphinus]

I'm sorry too for your loss/frustration. :cry: But you tried... This is a harsh hobby. :confused:

[Canadian Man]

Another sorry here Alan :cry:

[danny zubot]

That totally suck Alan, sorry to hear that. :cry:

[andestang]

:sad: sad dud

[Buccaneer]

:sad:

[Bob I]

Even though I am sad the fish died, I may seem rude, but my feeling is that the force feeding directly caused the death of the fish. One normally should not be concerned that newly purchased fish does not eat. One should leave it be for awhile to give it a chance to adjust. The torture you subjected it to killed it, period.
Yes of course you will say I am a b***tard for saying that, but that is my honest feeling. :sad:

[Samw]

On Saturday I bought a Regal Tang, and have yet to see it eat in my tank.

Well that is something I hadn't considered! I've once or twice called Deb "the Tang Whisperer" but that's about it... :smile:


Sorry to hear your loss. Hey, I was confused for a while there when you said Regal Tang and talked about Tang Whisperer but then showed a picture of an Angel fish. For a while I was going, where's the Regal (Hippo) Tang?

[AJ_77]

Thanks Sam, you're right - I posted the wrong fish (stress). :razz:
It was an Angel like in the photo. I thought today "it was on its way out when I brought it home - it went thin awfully fast..." but then realized I was merely deflecting the blame and the responsiblity - the fish was fine in the store - that's what attracted me to it. I didn't read enough to know how very shy these are, and how inappropriate it was for my tank, with a torpedo Tang and a Purple being added almost simultaneously.

On a brighter note, the Purple Tang came home last Sunday from Edmonton (thanks again to Will the Driver). It has almost made peace with my Blonde Naso and is a welcome (and healthy) addition. I think this 100gal is maxed out now: Naso, Purple, Lemonpeel Angel, YTdamsel, and a small Mandarin.

Until my next impulse purchase - SMACK!

[AJ_77]

Even though I am sad the fish died, I may seem rude, but my feeling is that the force feeding directly caused the death of the fish. One normally should not be concerned that newly purchased fish does not eat. One should leave it be for awhile to give it a chance to adjust. The torture you subjected it to killed it, period.
Yes of course you will say I am a b***tard for saying that, but that is my honest feeling. :sad:

I guess that might be the case Bob, but this one was dying anyways. I read that thinning of the musculature above and behind the head is a sign of doom, and even if they start eating again, once they reach this stage they're usually too far gone to recover. Mine had more thinning each day, in the critical area mentioned. I noticed it first after 2 days home without a nibble - no pecking, nothing. I determined at that point that I would try Kyle's method before I would watch it starve and die.

I would have preferred to "let it be" but it didn't give ME the chance. A healthy angel of this size shouldn't show thinning for a good week, and by then would have adjusted (hopefully). That's why I say this one was on the way out even befoe I brought it home.

[Bob I]

I guess it would be better to let the LFS take the loss. That way they will stop bringing in things that are doomed to die. On that premise I should not have bought my Three Spot either, but at least he is not thin, and eats very well. Even though I am sure I am not out of the woods yet either. :rolleyes:

[AJ_77]

I knew you were trying to tell me that when we were both at the LFS that day. Like a bonehead, I didn't listen. (blah blah blah, dismal survival rate, yada yada yada...) Thought I could defy the odds.

On a similar note, that little Bicolour I got for my son the same day is doing swimmingly. Everything he hoped for, and so full of spunk it's amazing. Eats like a little horse.

Hope your little angel does well.

[Bob I]

Absolutely true. You are indeed a bonehead, but no more so than I am a bonehead. I am one today, and have been in the past. Too often we go to a LFS, and see a fish, and can't resist it. In my case if it is small I will probably buy it. But we still need our heads examined. That is not an accusation, but merely an observation. :eek:

[albert_dao]

Absolutely true. You are indeed a bonehead, but no more so than I am a bonehead. I am one today, and have been in the past. Too often we go to a LFS, and see a fish, and can't resist it. In my case if it is small I will probably buy it. But we still need our heads examined. That is not an accusation, but merely an observation. :eek:

I love how Bob has such a polite and arbritrary way of letting us all know how silly we are for being in this hobby. haha

[Quinn]

So now that we've all lamented our shameful weaknesses, sackcloth and ashes et al., let's make sure we don't show ourselves to be hypocrites in the future.

[AJ_77]

Yeah, lets... can we still be morose? I just might delete this thread. :rolleyes:

[danny zubot]

Speaking of eating Alan, Did this copperband ever pick at your corals when you had him? I've seen him doing this but I'm sure it is only because my feeding regiment is different from yours. how oftern did you feed him?

[AJ_77]

Danny, the CBB did pick at a couple of Green/blue Candycane corals - but that's about it. Didn't even bother the Brain, which the Lemonpeel will take an occasional nip at.

What is he bothering there?

One last note about the Regal Angel - I don't want to give the impression the LFS in any way mislead me or that the fish was in poor health. It seemed fine, I bought it, it didn't make it. I told them I had the ideal home for it, and got a great deal too, so the reponsibility is mine.

I will shop there again, as they gave great information and support during and after this misadventure.

[danny zubot]

He has been noticed nipping at this elkhorn coral I have, which hasn't been doing well since I moved. It has the same fleshy type exterior as my candy corals, and its not that big of a deal as long as he leaves my acro and monti caps alone. :smile:

[TANGOMAN]

Alan. Firstly, sorry to hear the fish didn't pull through for ya'. :cry:
I admire and respect your determination in attempting to get the fish to ingest food.
Secondly. Bob, for you to say "force feeding directly killed the fish..." is an unfair accusation to make. If ya' wanna' get right down to it, organ failure was probably the direct cause of death. Once a fish begins showing signs of starvation/malnutrition, you can be assured internal organs are "shutting down" as they are serving no purpose. This is a difficult, if not impossible, process to reverse. You're knowledgable enough to know that! I do however respect you for admitting that you too are a bonehead. That's not quite what I was thinking when I initially read your response, but it'll do... :lol:
The attempt to get food into the "gut" is a last chance resort to avoid the innevitable. It's not like "plumping up a cow" in a feed lot prior to slaughter.
We all make regrettable decisions in life, not just in this hobby either. I too have brought home specimens who were sufferring in LFS tanks with the belief that the fish's only chance of survival was getting into the hands of someone who has the ability, and more importantly, the determination to provide what is needed for long term success. Perhaps I should just walk away and let the retailer take the loss. But I sometimes question the ethics in that as well... :confused: . What ever, the wife calls me a "fish hugger", and maybe that's why.
The topic of ethics is too varied to even get into and this is not what the discussion is regarding anyway. Alan discussed this experience with the retailer, and us, in a respectable manner. That's what counts in my eye's. That, and the fact that that he did every thing one could possible do.

So when I look up to the score board it reads: AJ77; 2, Bob_I; 0 :lol:

On a side note,
Quinn. What are they puttin' in the corn down there ? I can no longer understand a single word you say... :confused: . (Not that that's a bad thing... :lol: )