Why not to use io salt

[spit.fire]

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/01/634e170571391a7bc2c20f4bf5035b5b.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/01/262551321acd655501ac231f75af790f.jpg


All sps, half my lps, and almost all my inverts including my giant abalone, bristle worms, snails, conches, etc

[rsisvixen]

Was this the salt from the pet smart deal?

[gregzz4]

Holee crap

I had a bucket from KEs recently that must have been the dregs from their hoppers.
The big 3 tested off the charts through the whole bucket.
12.5
420
1650

Maybe you had an Alk spike ?

[NU-2reef]

Holy crap! That's devastating. What salt were you using before?

[spit.fire]

Holee crap

I had a bucket from KEs recently that must have been the dregs from their hoppers.
The big 3 tested off the charts through the whole bucket.
12.5
420
1650

Maybe you had an Alk spike ?
Alk spike shouldn't kill my snails

[Myka]

Oi! That's terrible! How did you come to the conclusion the salt did it? I'm not doubting you, I'm just wondering what exactly happened.

[canadianbudz604]

Why was it the salt? You've been in this hobby along time so what happened man?

[spit.fire]

Did a water change, woke up to dead stuff

[Myka]

Did a water change, woke up to dead stuff

New bucket? I assume you checked all the other stuff like temperature and dosers functioning properly.

[Bblinks]

It's very seldom u hear some thing that drastic happens from using a bad batch of salt. Usually it's the more sensitive species that go first then if that triggers s mass die off it would still take more than just overnight. I have once changed my water with 40 gallons of fresh wartet not realizing until after that it was fresh, the salinity dropped a few points but luckily my tank volume compensated for it and everything pulled through. I am not saying that's what happened to you but who knows. I have always used io and knock on wood, I have never had any issues.

Sorry about your loses bud, No matter what it's still hard. I'll have some frags for you in a little bit.

[dcw1sfu]

I was actually thinking of switching to IO from ddh2ocean salt but this has made me rethink that decision.

[spit.fire]

Thanks rich, we've been doing water changes with kz and the water is clearing up already, hopefully a water change a day will fix things, we stuffed as much of the LPs as we could in my nano hoping to save some stuff

[spit.fire]

New bucket? I assume you checked all the other stuff like temperature and dosers functioning properly.
New bucket, not running dosers, had to many problems with them so I refuse to use them

[spit.fire]

I was actually thinking of switching to IO from ddh2ocean salt but this has made me rethink that decision.
Once I run out of kz I'm switching to salinity

[Snappy]

Once I run out of kz I'm switching to salinity

I know of others that like Salinity but I personally have never had good luck with it.

[rayjay]

I've been using IO now for over 20 yrs and never had a problem due to salt.
Any problems I've had could honestly be attributed to something I did, or didn't do correctly.

[Myka]

If you can prove it`s the salt, your house insurance would probably cover some or all of the livestock under the coverage for pets. My own house insurance covers up to $5000 which includes equipment and livestock. That wouldn`t cover it for me, but it sure would help!

I've been using IO now for over 20 yrs and never had a problem due to salt.

It's never a problem until...it IS a problem. Kinda like the Kent Carbon recall from a few years back. I used Kent Carbon for a decade before that happened.

[Aquattro]

While issues with salt can and have happened, I've never seen an incident where only one person was affected. It's usually a batch, and many people suffer and report losses.

[Ron99]

I've been using IO for years too without problem. Are you sure your bucket or scoop or something else wasn't somehow contaminated with something? Maybe the water you used was somehow contaminated?

I'm not trying to minimize your loss which sucks but if you are the only who's experienced this it's not likely due to something others are using without problem.

[spit.fire]

If you can prove it`s the salt, your house insurance would probably cover some or all of the livestock under the coverage for pets. My own house insurance covers up to $5000 which includes equipment and livestock. That wouldn`t cover it for me, but it sure would help!



It's never a problem until...it IS a problem. Kinda like the Kent Carbon recall from a few years back. I used Kent Carbon for a decade before that happened.
I rent, no insurance. I'm not worried about cost of the loss, just frustrated

[Nate]

Salinity seems to be a go to for anyone that has had bad experiences with a salt.

I like that their batches are much smaller (36 buckets) and that each batch gets an indiviual third party analysis and a sticker is made up of the precise contents of each bucket by batch.

This alone is worth it for those that have had problems.


While we are on cool seachem facts. Every single person in their company from sales guys to accountants all have to have a fish tank. They feel that using the products is the best way to understand the business and show you believe in your product.


I know of others that like Salinity but I personally have never had good luck with it.

[gobytron]

if it was the salt, we should see at least a few more instances of this same thing coming up soon...

Unless somehow your bucket of salt was tampered with or something...

[TimT]

Sorry to hear about your loss. I threw IO to the curb a while ago because it was consistently inconsistent enough that it alarmed me. I'd used it since the mid 70's.

It's not just the big three that can nuke a tank. I lost a whole bunch of SPS to a bucket of reef salt(not IO or RC) that was deficient in Potassium.

Since the majority of the cost of salt mix is freight one must wonder how they can sell it so cheap. What quality are the chems used?

It's not correct to assume that just because no one else complained that it's not the salt. It's also not correct to assume that just because part of a batch is ok that the whole batch will be ok.

Cheers,
Tim

[gobytron]

Sorry to hear about your loss. I threw IO to the curb a while ago because it was consistently inconsistent enough that it alarmed me. I'd used it since the mid 70's.

It's not just the big three that can nuke a tank. I lost a whole bunch of SPS to a bucket of reef salt(not IO or RC) that was deficient in Potassium.

Since the majority of the cost of salt mix is freight one must wonder how they can sell it so cheap. What quality are the chems used?

It's not correct to assume that just because no one else complained that it's not the salt. It's also not correct to assume that just because part of a batch is ok that the whole batch will be ok.

Cheers,
Tim

Just as not correct to assume it was the salt though, no?

A fair guess, sure, but an absolute, it is not.

The salt can be tested and this can be put to rest.

I would contact IO if this happened to me.

[crimper]

Sorry to hear your loss. But maybe further testings should merit your claim.

I don't want to sound simplistic, but that claim can be proven. Maybe setup a 10G tank and throw in some snail, hermit crab, maybe a damsel fish and some not so nice corals in there and see what happens.

This will clear up lots of speculations.

[spit.fire]

Sorry to hear your loss. But maybe further testings should merit your claim.

I don't want to sound simplistic, but that claim can be proven. Maybe setup a 10G tank and throw in some snail, hermit crab, maybe a damsel fish and some not so nice corals in there and see what happens.

This will clear up lots of speculations.
Not willing to risk the livestock tbh or put any more thought into it. IMO its a waste of time, stuff is dead, I'm chucking the salt, life goes on.

[mark]

hope you're contacting IO about this. Sorry for your tank but maybe they're willing to do an analysis on the salt for the sake of others

[jorjef]

It looks like your tank is a bare bottom... Did you scour the tank bottom before you changed water?

[dcw1sfu]

Sorry to hear about your loss. I threw IO to the curb a while ago because it was consistently inconsistent enough that it alarmed me. I'd used it since the mid 70's.

It's not just the big three that can nuke a tank. I lost a whole bunch of SPS to a bucket of reef salt(not IO or RC) that was deficient in Potassium.

Since the majority of the cost of salt mix is freight one must wonder how they can sell it so cheap. What quality are the chems used?

It's not correct to assume that just because no one else complained that it's not the salt. It's also not correct to assume that just because part of a batch is ok that the whole batch will be ok.

Cheers,
Tim

What did you end up switching to after all those years of IO?

[TimT]

Just as not correct to assume it was the salt though, no?

Assumptions/generalizations are always risky and usually incorrect. :) So there's a funny saying... Assume = making an ASS out of U and ME

Normally I'm very hesitant to blame salt or other types of additives as it's usually something the hobbyist did or something that happened to the tank. This situation is different though. Spit.fire is an experienced hobbyist and able to discern if it was the salt, the water, the mixing pump or something he did. When combined with my own personal experiences with this salt, my knowledge of how much freight is for salt and the price it is sold for. I think it's a 90%+ chance it's the salt, but no one can know for sure.

If the salt mix had ammonia contamination it could easily do to a tank what was reported.


What did you end up switching to after all those years of IO?

I use either D+D or Red Sea as they are made from evaporated ocean water.

[e46er]

Wifey clean around the tank maybe spray something over it? Kids throw anything in it?
I know your an experienced reefer but I have a hard time seeing salt do that.

[Aquattro]

Wifey clean around the tank maybe spray something over it? Kids throw anything in it?
I know your an experienced reefer but I have a hard time seeing salt do that.

Oh, salt can do that, but it's not usually isolated. It was either Kent or IO a few years ago that had massive alk levels and wiped out crap loads of tanks, just like this.

[kien]

ugh.. the 'ol bucket full of calcium carbonate shot.. breaks my heart every time I see it. Sorry to hear dude. Been there, done that, got the wet t-shirt.

[spit.fire]

Wifey clean around the tank maybe spray something over it? Kids throw anything in it?
I know your an experienced reefer but I have a hard time seeing salt do that.

wife knows better, one of the tanks on the system is hers
kids know to stay away from the sump

[intarsiabox]

Have you mixed a fresh gallon of IO salt water to test what exactly is wrong with it?

[Myka]

Not willing to risk the livestock tbh or put any more thought into it. IMO its a waste of time, stuff is dead, I'm chucking the salt, life goes on.

Please don't do that. Please send a sample to IO. If there's an issue, and I'm inclined to believe it probably is the salt, then IO should know about it or more peoples' tanks could suffer the same fate as yours.

[crimper]

Assumptions/generalizations are always risky and usually incorrect. :) So there's a funny saying... Assume = making an ASS out of U and ME

Normally I'm very hesitant to blame salt or other types of additives as it's usually something the hobbyist did or something that happened to the tank. This situation is different though. Spit.fire is an experienced hobbyist and able to discern if it was the salt, the water, the mixing pump or something he did. When combined with my own personal experiences with this salt, my knowledge of how much freight is for salt and the price it is sold for. I think it's a 90%+ chance it's the salt, but no one can know for sure.

If the salt mix had ammonia contamination it could easily do to a tank what was reported.

I use either D+D or Red Sea as they are made from evaporated ocean water.

Tim,

I'll throw this just for the sake of argument.

If you are the manufacturer of say X-Salt and you have one user claiming your salt nuke his tank without any concrete evidence leading to that claim. Are you gonna assume that he is right knowing he is Mr. Saltwater Guru?

Isn't it also a right of every forum member to know whether the claim is true or just a false claim?

I'm not saying that Spit.fire has a false claim, maybe he is right on this that the salt really nuke his tank. But for now we don't know as he can't give us concrete proof that the salt really nuke his tank aside from assumption.

I just feel that it is our obligations to the community to post facts not false claim is this kind of posts doesn't do the community any good. The forum should't be a place to post unsupported claims and defamatory posts.

Again, I'm not saying that Spit.fire is not correct on his claim. Up to this point, there is no concrete evidence on his claim aside from assumption. I have lots of respect to the guy as he is a very experience reefer.

I seldom posts here but rather read all informative posts that experience reefer post here, but I thought I need to throw this one out here.

[Skimmer Juice]

agree with crimper should be easy enough to make some water test it and see what was actually wrong with the salt ! It could help somebody out who bought that salt from the sale. I have a couple buckets from the sale and have already done water changes in both my tanks . Thread tittle's like this could scare people away from using a great product . It would be nice to see what in the salt caused it if possible

[GoFish]

Touché to what Myka and crimper said.... I was thinking yesterday of posting the exact same thing as crimper. If I lived closer I would come grab some salt from that bucket before you throw it away. I trust your experience also spitfire but think it would really be beneficial for you to give a sample of that to someone to test if you don't feel like it yourself. Or send it in to IO like Myka suggested, I'll even offer to pay the postage if you're over it
Really sorry to see this happen to your tank :(
Pretty sure that's the most popular brand of salt and type of salt used, so it could have an impact on a lot of people who switch brands of salt too quickly now because they're scared of suffering the same fate as you.

So please help the community find a reason, if it takes me driving out there to grab a sample then so be it, if you're sure it was the salt.

[MKLKT]

Plus if you toss it and it turns out to not be the salt you haven't solved the Scooby mystery.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

I will be in Aldergrove this Friday and can pick up a sample of the salt for testing if Vancity wants to meet after the weekend. I've been using IO salt and I know & respect spitfire's years of reefing experience. If we can have the salt tested by the company and have a definitive answer as to what parameter is off, that would ease my mind and the minds of a lot of other reefers. Just putting this offer out there. I can meet you at Oceanic if you want.

Thanks,

Anthony

[GoFish]

Just send me a text if you figure it out Anthony, If Tyler hasn't thrown it out yet

[The Guy]

I have a new unopened bucket of IO from King ED, if you want a little for comparison testing.
I have used IO since I started reefing 3 years ago and have never had any issues so far so good.

[jason604]

My biggest fear is waking up 1 morning to everything wiped. So sorry it happened to U. This is why I won't go all out on my tank Cuz it can be dead the next day. Damn. Please try to find the problem so we all can try to avoid

[Myka]

You could FedEx a sample to me. Just stick it in a bag and print off a shipping label...FedEx will come pick it up from your house and even put it in a box for you. I'll pay for it. Pm me if that's what you want to do.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

You could FedEx a sample to me. Just stick it in a bag and print off a shipping label...FedEx will come pick it up from your house and even put it in a box for you. I'll pay for it. Pm me if that's what you want to do.

That's an even easier solution. Thanks Myka.

[gobytron]

Assumptions/generalizations are always risky and usually incorrect. :) So there's a funny saying... Assume = making an ASS out of U and ME

Normally I'm very hesitant to blame salt or other types of additives as it's usually something the hobbyist did or something that happened to the tank. This situation is different though. Spit.fire is an experienced hobbyist and able to discern if it was the salt, the water, the mixing pump or something he did. When combined with my own personal experiences with this salt, my knowledge of how much freight is for salt and the price it is sold for. I think it's a 90%+ chance it's the salt, but no one can know for sure.

If the salt mix had ammonia contamination it could easily do to a tank what was reported


I use either D+D or Red Sea as they are made from evaporated ocean water.

Now who's making an ass out of u and me?

With no testing done, experience is irrelevant.

I think it's actually important to test this salt, many of us trust IO and have for a decade or more.

[TimT]

So before this gets out of hand due to mis understandings of intent and assumptions let me clarify and revise my thoughts and offer a suggestion to CanReef members and mods.

Now who's making an ass out of u and me?

This was meant as a joke and not an attack. If I have offended you or anyone else I am sorry for that.


With no testing done, experience is irrelevant.


I agree 100%. Testing is very important and will reveal a lot. An expert witness relies on their experience and also testing to back up their opinion. It was wrong of me to assume that straight experience was enough, no matter how much experience a person has.


I think it's actually important to test this salt, many of us trust IO and have for a decade or more.

I agree.

My suggestion for community members and CanReef mods is this. Unless there is actual tests that reveal a problem with a product there should be no negative posts about that product. Mods should watch out for these posts and delete them as they occur.

Back to work...lunch breaks over. LoL

[davej]

Hey Tim don't worry too much, he just likes to stir the pot every chance he gets. If you read back thru his posts many, many are just stirring the pot. It gets old quick.

[TimT]

Hi Dave,

I understand but I wanted to make sure there was no mis understandings or hurt feelings. As well I have corrected my belief that an Expert Witness uses testing to verify their conclusions, not just their experience. So I needed to apologize and revise my position as it's changed due to the thread.

Cheers,
Tim

[gobytron]

Hi Dave,

I understand but I wanted to make sure there was no mis understandings or hurt feelings. As well I have corrected my belief that an Expert Witness uses testing to verify their conclusions, not just their experience. So I needed to apologize and revise my position as it's changed due to the thread.

Cheers,
Tim

I don't really see how there is any pot stirring here.

Sometimes, people have 2 different opinions and they talk it out to see if there is a mutual understanding possible.

Here above, TimT agreed with my statements, and I took no offense whatsoever to his.

His referral to making an ass out of u and me was tongue in cheek, as was mine.

I merely found his statement contradictory and pointed that out.

if you go onto an online forum and share your opinion, you really should be comfortable with others sharing theirs...whether they agree with you or not.

Seems like quite a few members were saying that testing should be required before any conclusions made...including TimT.

Dave, maybe you can shed some light on why you felt I needed to be singled out out of all of those who shared their opinions.

PM please if you care to to keep this thread on topic.

[GoFish]

Tyler (Spitfire) where are you? I Pm'd yesterday but no reply, I've seen you online...
Totally understand if you're over it and don't wanna think about anymore, you lost a bucket full of coral and that sucks...

However, unless you started this thread for the intention bad mouthing IO and then walking away from this you really aren't doing this any good by staying out of it. Testing and finding a conclusion to this mishap is intriguing, I'd love to know what went wrong and what to look out for. Batch #? Where did you buy it? I assume you no longer work for a retailer that sells this salt?

If salt alone nuked one of my tanks I'd be ****ed, but I'd definitely want some answers, or was it user error...

[davej]

Having bad day at work and was grumpy, should have just PM'd Tim and told him to not take it personally.
Bowing out.

[gobytron]

Tyler (Spitfire) where are you? I Pm'd yesterday but no reply, I've seen you online...
Totally understand if you're over it and don't wanna think about anymore, you lost a bucket full of coral and that sucks...

However, unless you started this thread for the intention bad mouthing IO and then walking away from this you really aren't doing this any good by staying out of it. Testing and finding a conclusion to this mishap is intriguing, I'd love to know what went wrong and what to look out for. Batch #? Where did you buy it? I assume you no longer work for a retailer that sells this salt?

If salt alone nuked one of my tanks I'd be ****ed, but I'd definitely want some answers, or was it user error...

User error unlikely given the op.

If it isn't the salt, it likely some outside factor.

Kids or some substance that accidentally got into the air or water or something that may never be known, unfortunately.

[Aquattro]

Tim, while I understand where you're coming from, I can't remove every post that suggests something is negative. The backlash is more than I would care to argue about.
These discussions always run a course. One person posts something, the burden of proof is then expected vocally by the community. Without the proof being presented, it's simply conjecture, and in the end, the product does not suffer (significant) harm.
We get one or two posts a year blaming salt for issues. They may or may not be true. Unless tampered with, the chances of a single bucket causing issues with no other reports, especially with a product so widely used, suggests that other things may have contributed. I'm not suggesting it wasn't salt, but without testing and subsequent proof, I'm not tossing out my IO salt.
I also get that Tyler doesn't want to keep chasing an issue that won't fix his problem, so we're not likely to get any resolve on this. In the end, it's a civil discussion that doesn't require censoring, IMO.

[gobytron]

Man we're gonna miss your moderation.

[somafish]

Man we're gonna miss your moderation.

+1

[daplatapus]

+2

Woo-hoo! Another post with math! :D

[somafish]

+2

Woo-hoo! Another post with math! :D

-1

[gregzz4]

Man we're gonna miss your moderation.
+3 Brad
You have a great way of coming across very succinctly but still manage to keep it light

Oh, I'm not dumping my IO either

[Aquattro]

You're all jacking this thread. First warning. Still like me?? :razz:

[spit.fire]

Salt is gone, Albert was here when it happened, we did everything we could to diagnose the problem and came to the conclusion that it was the salt. We mixed the water earlier in the day with the same system I've been using for years. The system was mature and very stable. The inverts and corals started dieing within hours.

[spit.fire]

You're all jacking this thread. First warning. Still like me?? :razz:
I still like you :)

[spit.fire]

User error unlikely given the op.

If it isn't the salt, it likely some outside factor.

Kids or some substance that accidentally got into the air or water or something that may never be known, unfortunately.
Kids went home from the time salt was mixed till the next day

[Myka]

Why would you toss the salt without getting it tested?

[spit.fire]

Why would you toss the salt without getting it tested?

why not toss the salt without getting it tested, sorry i do not have a mass-spectrometer nor intend on to pay for the testing that it would require to come to a definite conclusive result

[The Guy]

I agree with Myka the salt should have been tested, now saying the tank was nuked by the IO salt is an opinion of you and Albert and all of us following your thread will now never have a conclusive answer as to the salt quality. Myka offered to bare the cost of testing it, so why wouldn't you do it, then at least we would have an answer.

[GoFish]

Why would you toss the salt without getting it tested?

+2

And +4 Brad :sad:

Oooh more numbers this thread needed.

1+2-1+3+2+4=11dkh??

[hondas3000]

I have some cheap coral and tank I can test the the salt out for you. If they all die too then for sure its the salt. As I am using instant salt myself too.

[gregzz4]

I have some cheap coral and tank I can test the the salt out for you. If they all die too then for sure its the salt. As I am using instant salt myself too.
There is still no guarantee with you using his salt.
Too many variables to consider.

I agree with all other posts that state the salt needs to be tested under scrutiny/lab standards.
Only then can the problem be found.

I said before and will say it again.
I'm still going to use my IO for now.

[albert_dao]

Wellp, here are the events:

Crack new bucket. Mixed salt. Waited four hours. Did water change. Stuff got dead. Water tested normal for all testable parameters :D

Fish are happy. Corals look like they've had an abrasive pad applied to them liberally. It's really odd, not your regular RTN event. A lot of them kept polyps, but lost all surrounding tissue. All mollusk and echinoderms were pretty much dead withing a couple hours.

Maybe a better title for this thread would have been "I did a normal water change and wiped out my tank. I am speculating that the salt was the culprit - Or evil voodoo magic. 50/50"

[Aquattro]

I am speculating that the salt was the culprit - Or evil voodoo magic. 50/50"

And that's my concern. Why are we not blaming voodoo magic? I know I've lost more to that than I ever have with anything else. Of course, the possibility that the voodoo magic was in the salt needs to be considered. I really hate voodoo..sigh

However, on the testing front, unless alk is through the roof, there's not much we can test this side of a lab. Which IO would need to do, because none of us know what any particular value should be in the first place.

And, can a lab test for VM?? I dunno.

[daplatapus]

And, can a lab test for VM?? I dunno.

Pretty sure it takes some bat guano and eye of newt. Not sure where you might get eye of newt this time of year...

[gregzz4]

We have a forum member who works at a Lab just down the road from me.
Only thing is they are pricey. I think it's a minimum charge issue. I was quoted $250 for a bromine test, but that's what we paid for all our water quality tests at work.

[Aquattro]

Not sure where you might get eye of newt this time of year...

I still have some in the freezer from the last VM test. I have bats around the house, but chasing around behind them is a bit tiring. Agile little beasts...

[Aquattro]

We have a forum member who works at a Lab just down the road from me.
Only thing is they are pricey. I think it's a minimum charge issue. I was quoted $250 for a bromine test, but that's what we paid for all our water quality tests at work.

Problem is you'd need to run the voodoo salt AND a control batch to compare values to. So double the cost right there. And what to test for? Bromine? Adamantium? Voodoo?
A full spectrum test for everything that could be in salt, and for everything that shouldn't be in salt is going to run a big bill.

[The Guy]

Wellp, here are the events:

Crack new bucket. Mixed salt. Waited four hours. Did water change. Stuff got dead. Water tested normal for all testable parameters :D

Fish are happy. Corals look like they've had an abrasive pad applied to them liberally. It's really odd, not your regular RTN event. A lot of them kept polyps, but lost all surrounding tissue. All mollusk and echinoderms were pretty much dead withing a couple hours.

Maybe a better title for this thread would have been "I did a normal water change and wiped out my tank. I am speculating that the salt was the culprit - Or evil voodoo magic. 50/50"
But nobody following this thread will ever know for sure without a test of the salt will they?
I will continue to use IO salt as nothing was conclusive proving bad salt was the "issue" here. I'll be doing a WC within a couple of days and we will see what happens if anything. :neutral:

[Aquattro]

But nobody following this thread will ever know for sure without a test of the salt will they?


And I will ask again, what is he supposed to test? Unless he contacts IO and they're willing to test and can find something in the test panel that is off, we still won't know, and a lot of trouble has been gone through to learn nothing.

[MKLKT]

I'm just honestly very curious as to what could do such rapid damage, that's more than just one parameter slightly over/under. That's some serious scorched reef.

The only thing I've had personally that caused a chain reaction like that was my GSP spawning which killed my snails (but not urchins, anemones or crabs.) which led to massive water quality issues. Took me a couple months to bring everything back. But it's not similar because it didn't really **** off the corals.

[crimper]

So we can safely say that Voodooo is the culprit. This thread should be renamed and should be buried into the archives with the verdict NOT GUILTY!

[Aquattro]

If I had to bet some cash on guessing what one thing could do that, I'd guess copper.
Is it possible to tamper with a bucket and add copper somehow?

[davej]

If I had lost that much and I thought the salt was to blame, you can be SURE the manufacturer would be hearing from me.

[Aquattro]

If I had lost that much and I thought the salt was to blame, you can be SURE the manufacturer would be hearing from me.

Ya, me too. But not everyone is the same.

[Aquattro]

And IO will examine a sample if sent to them, they require a couple cups in a zip lock for testing.

[The Guy]

And I will ask again, what is he supposed to test? Unless he contacts IO and they're willing to test and can find something in the test panel that is off, we still won't know, and a lot of trouble has been gone through to learn nothing.

It just seems the whole thread just got a lot of people all excited without any kind of conclusive proof of the salt being the problem is all I'm trying say. I agree with you Brad at the end of the day we've learned nothing. :mrgreen:

[Aquattro]

Agreed, we know nothing, other than Tyler lost a ****eload of stuff. Could be from salt, or something that was in the salt bucket.
Yes, IO is a cheaper salt, but they've been doing a lot of it for a long time with a pretty good track record, so I still maintain that if it's the salt, others will have the same issue eventually.
Not sure if the purchase location of the salt has been disclosed, but I bet other CR members also bought some from the same batch.

[The Guy]

I bought this new unopened bucket @ King Ed, Opp's did I type that out loud. :tape:

[Aquattro]

I bought this new unopened bucket @ King Ed.

Where did he buy his bucket?

[The Guy]

Where did he buy his bucket?
I think that question was asked but I don't remember seeing an answer.

[rsisvixen]

Could be metal contamination, excess lvls of copper, that would wipe out inverts yet leave fish healthy.

[gobytron]

It just seems the whole thread just got a lot of people all excited without any kind of conclusive proof of the salt being the problem is all I'm trying say. I agree with you Brad at the end of the day we've learned nothing. :mrgreen:

if you were to mix some of it up and put a small frag in it, one of the same kind as one that was lost by the OP, It's survival or demise would at least tell you if it was the salt or not.

From there, testing would be needed to see if there is something in it there that is not supposed to be or if something in it is more concentrated than it should be.

A pretty simple test as above (and has already been suggested) would definitely add some important information to the issue and at least indicate if the salt needs to be tested or if other potential causes need to be considered more seriously.

[spit.fire]

I think that question was asked but I don't remember seeing an answer.

thats because i do not know the answer, it could have come from one of 5 places that i get salt from, no idea, i grab a bucket from my stash, never kept track of what buckets came from where

[Myka]

why not toss the salt without getting it tested, sorry i do not have a mass-spectrometer nor intend on to pay for the testing that it would require to come to a definite conclusive result
IO would do the testing with their lab. All it would cost you is a few minutes of time. I even made an offer to minimize that time for you. :)

Plus, if it was something like copper, your tank (rock/sand) could now be permanently toxic to invertebrates.

[spit.fire]

Why are you taking this so personally? I made it pretty clear that I have no interest in getting it tested. The only thing beneficial thing that would ever come out of it is maybe a free bucket of io that I'd use to de-ice driveways with.... Its not worth the effort it would take to put it in a zip lock bag. The damage is done, I've accepted that there is no fixing it, so I'm moving on, as should you.

[Skimmer Juice]

Why are you taking this so personally? I made it pretty clear that I have no interest in getting it tested. The only thing beneficial thing that would ever come out of it is maybe a free bucket of io that I'd use to de-ice driveways with.... Its not worth the effort it would take to put it in a zip lock bag. The damage is done, I've accepted that there is no fixing it, so I'm moving on, as should you.

why make a thread about it then ?

[spit.fire]

I believe the word is venting
So why not make a thread about it

[gobytron]

You must have seen "blame the salt" posts in the past and known exactly how it would pan out....

The only difference here is that it's usually not someone with so much know how and experience posting it.

I think that fact just makes people more curious as most others who make a statement like this are uniformly dismissed.

Also, many of us use io.

You scare people with this kind of a claim.

You may feel there is no point, but the rest of us who use io and know you know your **** would sure like to know for sure if it was the salt we all use or not.

[Bblinks]

I use IO....

[jorjef]

:laluot_08: Good god people he said it was the salt... There is no onus to proof, it's an opinion the can take it or ignore it. If people are so worried send your own salt away to get tested. As someone else said it doesn't seem to be a widespread epidemic so go on living your lives.

[Skimmer Juice]

:laluot_08: Good god people he said it was the salt... There is no onus to proof, it's an opinion the can take it or ignore it. If people are so worried send your own salt away to get tested. As someone else said it doesn't seem to be a widespread epidemic so go on living your lives.
I'm thinking you don't understand what a forum is used for ? If you come on a forum claiming salt nuked your tank , people are going to be curious why . If it was indeed the salt would you not want to find out what in the salt caused it? If you want to forget about it and move on why make a thread about it and not expect anybody to wonder why ?
I would send my own salt away for testing if it nuked my tank if not for me but all the other people that use this salt. Never had any issues using reef crystals so I have no need to get it tested. Is salt even safe to use after 4 hours of mixing? Was always under the impression to let it mix for 24 hours. Either way its obvious nothing is going to come from this original poster is not going to send any samples in , it sucks for the rest of us . Will continue to use IO until there is actual proof the salt caused this.

[Myka]

Why are you taking this so personally? I made it pretty clear that I have no interest in getting it tested. The only thing beneficial thing that would ever come out of it is maybe a free bucket of io that I'd use to de-ice driveways with.... Its not worth the effort it would take to put it in a zip lock bag. The damage is done, I've accepted that there is no fixing it, so I'm moving on, as should you.

Because of this:

Also, many of us use io.

You scare people with this kind of a claim.

You may feel there is no point, but the rest of us who use io and know you know your **** would sure like to know for sure if it was the salt we all use or not.

I would send my own salt away for testing if it nuked my tank if not for me but all the other people that use this salt.

Pretty much. :)

[jorjef]

Only for the reason that most reef related debates end in a spiraling school yard I'm right and you're wrong abiss I will end this with. You're right. You win skimmer juice. I will look further into the proper understanding and use of on line forum

[Nate]

A few years ago I was the rep of an accused product (not salt though)... I've offered credits to retailers whom purchased the product, so they could refund their consumers as it cost less than the testing of said product . In the end it was not the product and another product was found to be at fault, but the forums had done their dirty work and the product had a bad rep. I don't even think it was made public what caused all the trouble but it was a member here who had the issues. Those credits were still issued and the product was not to blame. The internet , and forums can be nuts sometimes and turn things into a witchhunt.

Anyone reading this realizes that it is not conclusive, but might make sure to do an extra test or two of their salt before water changes which I would suspect is what the op is was trying to establish.

I too would have sent some to upg, to have tested. But would have probably declined there free bucket had it been offered whatever the results may have been .

[Bblinks]

:laluot_08: Good god people he said it was the salt... There is no onus to proof, it's an opinion the can take it or ignore it. If people are so worried send your own salt away to get tested. As someone else said it doesn't seem to be a widespread epidemic so go on living your lives.

I got a lot invested in my tank so if there is bad salt circulating I would like to know....I am too chicken poop to be playing reindeer games with my tank.

[WarDog]

I got a lot invested in my tank so if there is bad salt circulating I would like to know....I am too chicken poop to be playing reindeer games with my tank.

Agreed. I am mixing a batch right now, albeit and older bucket I've already used. I bought 3 buckets during the sale, so that's got me a little concerned.

Spit.fire , did you not even record the batch # for us?

[reefwars]

Anyone here selling IO for cheap??:pp

[reefwars]

You should all be weary of your salt and brands don't matter I've had customers return every type of salt for all sorys of reasons and even once salt had no salt measured with a refract... it had nothing so prob a bucket of chemicals , sure sucks to be on the end of that I use to think then it happened so often that I just assume salt QC is crap and take each bucket with caution :) most of us are very lucky but I'll say that bad salt is not uncommon at all:)

[GoFish]

I got a lot invested in my tank so if there is bad salt circulating I would like to know....
This was my thinking from the beginning but doesn't look like an answer will come. I've given up waiting anyway...

I have a new question that hasn't been brought up

"How does someone dispose of 48lbs of salt?" Well subtract what was used for the water change

In my garbage can?
In my backyard?
Down the drain?
In the ocean?
In the river?
Take it to the dump?
Save it for de-icing the driveway?

There's only one question above that I could answer yes to. So what's the best way to dispose of that much salt, minus the bucket I hope cause that thing's recyclable

I will also be keeping and using my buckets, just merely wondering what others would do

[reefwars]

Go slug hunting lol

[GoFish]

Oooh good one :) too bad I only see about 5 of those a year

[reefwars]

Haha yeah that's about 1000 yrs worth of slugs ....back to the drawing board lol

[Aquattro]

I got rid of a bucket via the de-icing method.

[gregzz4]

I will keep using my IO, even with the last bucket I had reading #s too high for my liking. Batch # 14267
Rolled and tested for weeks - Alk 11.5+, Ca 410(good for us who dose), Mag 1650+(not good if you perform large WCs)
Salt was very dusty instead of powdery/grainy. Had to hold my breath while taking it from the bucket and adding it to the mixing tank - dust everywhere.
It also needed 7 cups instead of 6 cups to mix 12g of water. Obviously the salt was messed up. But it still never killed anything.

I turned off my Mag pump 6 weeks ago and have just turned it back on this week as it took 2 weeks for it to drop enough to start dosing again.

I test my new salt water before each WC to keep an eye on things and adjust it accordingly

[The Guy]

I will keep using my IO, even with the last bucket I had reading #s too high for my liking. Batch # 14267
Rolled and tested for weeks - Alk 11.5+, Ca 410(good for us who dose), Mag 1650+(not good if you perform large WCs)
Salt was very dusty instead of powdery/grainy. Had to hold my breath while taking it from the bucket and adding it to the mixing tank - dust everywhere.
It also needed 7 cups instead of 6 cups to mix 12g of water. Obviously the salt was messed up. But it still never killed anything.

I turned off my Mag pump 6 weeks ago and have just turned it back on this week as it took 2 weeks for it to drop enough to start dosing again.

I test my new salt water before each WC to keep an eye on things and adjust it accordingly
So where on the bucket do you find a batch #, there's a bunch numbers around the sque but it's the same # on all my empty buckets :noidea:

[GoFish]

So where on the bucket do you find a batch #, there's a bunch numbers around the sque but it's the same # on all my empty buckets :noidea:
It's the price tag looking sticker on the top of the lid. should be 14xxx or 15xxx depending on how long you've had it I guess

[The Guy]

It's the price tag looking sticker on the top of the lid. should be 14xxx or 15xxx depending on how long you've had it I guess
Thanks, there is a mostly wrecked unreadable sticker on the lid that ends with 61, that's all I can see. Not that it matters I guess, it is what it is I'm still using it.

[gregzz4]

Sorry Laurie, ya the little white stickers on top.
If you bought it from KE and it ends in 61 it's probably 14261. I bought that # somewhere before Jan.
Come to think of it, I don't even know if that tag is from IO or KE.