The Dirty Sps Tank

[jason604]

Since day 1 of starting this hobby(almost 2 yrs) I've always been told in order to keep a successful reef tank, especially a sps dominate tank I would have to keep my nitrates and phosphates at 0. Recently I stumbled across a thread on another forums that there's a lot of ppl experimenting or keeping their tanks long term with nitrates about 5-10ppm with their sps colors deepening to an amazing Pop within as little as a week. They either increase their fish load or feed a ton. Some even dose liquid nitrates to keep their systems that way. And then there's also WWC Corals Flordia that Keeps their 300g display tank at 30-40ppm and it is nth but amazing. There are a few that runs their skimmer on a timer and claims that having nitrates higher also decreased their phosphate levels and was able to put their Gfo reactor offline, but I'm not sure how that works. Always thought nitrates and phosphates run in correlations. Of course you have to monitor every step of the way if you want this to be successful. I think too fast and too much will for sure brown out corals. So the question is. How many of you are running "The dirty sps tank"? For how long? And what are your results?

[jason604]

Crap. Plz move to the reef section sorry

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

I find that Purple validas are not bothered too much by high nitrates/phosphates compared to other sps species.

[mihaivapler]

i have a 130 gallon set-up mixt with 50/50 lps and sps and i do exactly like that,i have lots of fish feed them like crazy so they look like pigs,about 4-5 times a day 2 of them with brine and mysis shrimp and another 2-3 of pellets,i think does help having the tank next to my couch:)),and my nitrates are about 20 ppm and my sps grow like crazy some off them doubled the size in one month...i think this is a good thing,as my fish are fat and healty and the corals love it.all i do is a water chance every two weeks of 20 gallons and a good skimmer..

[jason604]

Hmmmm interesting. Do u happen to have a before and after pic or have u left ur nitrates that high since day 1?

[Myka]

I touched this subject in a recent thread regarding Reef Raft corals (post #27)... http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=109720

I like to keep a measurable amount of nitrate in my tanks, maybe 2-5 ppm. The SPS do have a richer color. Certainly not 30 ppm though - that's quite excessive.

[jason604]

Did u guys have long hair algae problems with higher nitrate? I would rather have pale sps than to have a tank full of algae again. It suffocated so many of my corals.

[Reef Pilot]

Not sure about nitrates, but I think you are OK up to about 5 ppm. But I know with my tank, when P04 is lowest (0.00 readings on my Hanna) is when I get my best SPS growth and color. Of course this does vary by SPS type, as some are definitely more tolerant than others.

Algae also really loves P04, and is hard to eradicate once it takes hold, even when both P04 and N03 are back to zero. The thing with algae is that it traps detritus and will grow in rocks, sand or wherever it can find some nutrients. That's why some manual removal with a toothbrush and turkey basting to keep your rocks clean is necessary. And I think the light spectrum you use will help or hinder algae.

[mihaivapler]

Hmmmm interesting. Do u happen to have a before and after pic or have u left ur nitrates that high since day 1?

No unfortunately I don't take pictures.I tried to keep them as close to zero but it just seems no matter what I try I can't so i keept only softies and lps.after reading in a thread about having success keeping sps in dirtier water I gave a shoot and it worked out perfectly. The results are very good.

[mihaivapler]

Did u guys have long hair algae problems with higher nitrate? I would rather have pale sps than to have a tank full of algae again. It suffocated so many of my corals.

I didn't had any issues with the hair algae.I had some Dino at the beginning when I set up the tank but not is clean.as for hair algae maybe having few tangs they tare care of the lawn:))

[Myka]

Did u guys have long hair algae problems with higher nitrate? I would rather have pale sps than to have a tank full of algae again. It suffocated so many of my corals.

It's all about balance. You need good enough flow, a good enough skimmer, good enough maintenance practices, and the right critters in the tank to help by pecking at rocks (keeping detritus from settling). Phosphate is troublesome with algae, you want that to stay low.

Saying that, I know two tanks personally that are way overstocked and way, way, way overfed (think 4x what they need). One of those tanks sits around 40-60 ppm nitrate (a few softies) and the other is close to 100 ppm (it's fish only, no skimmer). Neither tank would sustain SPS corals, but there isn't a speck of algae in either tank and both tanks have reef lighting.

[mihaivapler]

Did u guys have long hair algae problems with higher nitrate? I would rather have pale sps than to have a tank full of algae again. It suffocated so many of my corals.

It's all about balance. You need good enough flow, a good enough skimmer, good enough maintenance practices, and the right critters in the tank to help by pecking at rocks (keeping detritus from settling). Phosphate is troublesome with algae, you want that to stay low.

Saying that, I know two tanks personally that are way overstocked and way, way, way overfed (think 4x what they need). One of those tanks sits around 40-60 ppm nitrate (a few softies) and the other is close to 100 ppm (it's fish only, no skimmer). Neither tank would sustain SPS corals, but there isn't a speck of algae in either tank and both tanks have reef lighting.
It's true.I know a friend who have sps only tank and he keeps the phosphates and nitrates to zero with bio-pelets and on the same kind of sps mine looks better then his
.

[iceman86]

People keep their tanks wiyh nitrates for the corals to feed but you have to keep phosphates low but I wouldnt go over 10 for nitrates. I have tried this approach and it works but you have constant algae and detritus build up. Always cleaning your glass, changing filter socks, vacuuming sandbed, etc and im not a big fan of more maintenace. Now I keep nitrates and phosphates at 0, but I add a few drops of amino acid and the somtimes sps food. A lot less work for me, better colours and growth. All, i do now for maintenace is empty the skimmer cup and wipe a very light dust off the glass every 7-10 days. Let your equipment do the dirty work for you in your tank!

[kien]

I would say that it depends heavily on the corals themselves. Some are perfectly fine with a "dirty" tank while others won't stand for it at all. In this regard it is a bit of trial and error. I've run my tank with 5ppm nitrates as well as near zero as well as above 10. I've had SPS survive all 3 levels of nitrates but I've also had SPS die at all 3 levels. Over last summer my skimmer died and my bioPellets ran out so I was running a fairly dirty tank. I had a lot of SPS that were fine, but I also had a few completely brown out and some even died. When I turned the tank around (new skimmer, new pellets), all my browned out corals regained their colour. All my dead corps remained dead. I'm probably running somewhere near 1-3ppm nitrates and near zero (but not exactly zero) phosphates at the moment. I've found my best results to be 1-5 ppm nitrates.

[jason604]

Kien how u keep it constantly at that lvl of nitrates? Just test daily and feed more/less? Do u run Gfo n have macro algae? How many hours do u run blues/white lights?

[kien]

Kien how u keep it constantly at that lvl of nitrates? Just test daily and feed more/less? Do u run Gfo n have macro algae? How many hours do u run blues/white lights?

Well, for me it's mostly based on experience. I don't actually try to keep it at that level. It just happens to fall at that level due to my setup. So, it's not constantly at that level. Or at least I don't think it is.

I've been running bioPellets for the past 5 years, and I know that (for me) the bioPellets don't reduce my nitrates down to absolute zero. I've tested this with a pinpoint nitrate meter and at best they drop down to maybe 1ppm or somewhere near there. My nitrates will read "zero" on standard chemical test kits (API, etc), but I know that it's not really zero. It's more like "almost zero but not quite, probably 1ppm or lower". Again, verified with a pinpoint nitrate probe. If I take my bioPellets off line and just rely on skimming my nitrates will go up and hover around 5. That's just what it does with good skimming and water changes.

I control phosphates with GFO in a media bag and just let it do its thing. With GFO running my phosphates typically drop down to near zero as well. That is, zero as read on standard phosphate test kids (API, hana, etc). But again, I know that this doesn't mean that my phosphates are at absolute zero.

In addition, I think I feed fairly heavily and have a fairly heavy bioload.

My Blue lights (22K T5s) for 12 hours (10am to 10pm) while my halides (14K) run for 6 hours.