Unhappy Corals

[RMC]

Hi,
This is my first post on this forum. I'm new to the hobby, started with a used RSM 130 about 7 months ago. I have upgraded to the InTank media rack (loaded with floss, purigen and chemi-pure) with the Tunze 9001. Also added a Vortech MP10ES for more flow.

Over the past serveral months I have read and read, trying to take it slow. I quickly learned the important of Quarantine, after a ich outbreak. I am now ultra caution of anything I introduce to the tank, corals are quarantined in a 5.5 gal and fish in a 20 gal.

I currently have two clowns, 1 fire shrimp, 2 cleaner shrimp, ~6 blue legged hermits, a conch of some kind, toadstool coral, torch and a green flower pot. Unfortunately, I did not research the flower pot before the purchase and have now learned they are very hard to keep and likely will not last more than a year.

I have tested all the parameters with the following results:
Temp - 79
Salinity - 1.025
Phosphate - 0.00 via Hanna Checker
Calcium - 380 (a little low, currently adjusting the C Balance dose manually)
Alkalinity - 143 (a little low, currently adjusting the C Balance dose manually)
Nitrate - 0
Ammonia - 0

Despite working hard on my parameters over the past few months, for the past two weeks my corals appear unhappy. The Toadstool is not extending it's polyps, or very patchy extension. The flow pot is about the same and now the torch polyps are shortening as well. Quite honestly, I feel I'm doing all the right things and still coming up short. My frustration is building... any help or advise is much appreciated. Thank you in advance

[Craigdillman]

Hrm seems a bit weird as your parameters are all inline, has anything changed recently? We're the corals ok before and now having trouble or steady decline?

Also wondering about your dosing and your WC scedual cause most time new tanks don't have much demand for dosing so it isn't. Needed till corals start to use more of the calcium and Alk up in between water changes

If say start with some easy things like a water cjange and maybe some more frequent ones for the next bit see if that helps.

Also are you feeding anything to your corals reef roids frenzy or anything like that it could be that your water is too clean and your GFO and carbon are stripping the water of all the nutrients before they get to use them

That's my 2 cents for now

:) good luck

[brotherd]

Did you increase your light intensity or duration?

[RMC]

Thanks for the quick replies

Craigdillman – The Toadstool was my first coral and was very full and healthy since introduced 4 months ago. The flowerpot was QT’ed for 4 weeks and was extended for about two weeks before slowly declining. The torch was also QT’ed for 4 weeks and introduced to the DT about two weeks, again it was good in QT and the display tank and has declined in the last few days. I'm not supplementing with any coral food, WC are 20% every 3-4 weeks with IO Reef Crystals. Does 20% every two weeks sound better? I originally thought with my parameters in line, I would be able to do them every 4 weeks.

brotherd – no change in lighting other than replacing 1 of the 2 Compact Fluorescents about 5 weeks ago. I changed both bulbs one at a time over 2 months. The lights are on for about 14 hours each day, 7:30 AM – 9:30PM. Is that too long?

[Craigdillman]

Werid that they do better in at than main? What's the difference between the two tanks

[Sebae again]

I would cut back or even remove the Purigen and Chemi-pure for awhile at least. Your tank is '' too clean '' for LPS

[canadianbudz604]

Did your qt have chemi pure? I know the first 3 or 4 times I used chemi pure all of my Lps closed up. Must have something to do with the Gfo in it?!?

[RMC]

The QT tank I use for coral is a 5.5 Gal with a small HOB wheel style filter with floss inserted into it (no carbon or anything else). The suggestion of my tank being “too clean” does make sense. I’m thinking of removing the Chemi-pure, as that was the last form of media added, about 2.5 month ago, then see if the coral improve. I do like the “polished” look of the water with the Chemi-pure. If the removal of the Chemi-pure works, I may add carbon to get the polished look and monitor the situation!?!

Thanks everyone for your input. If it wasn’t for such a supportive community I may have been discouraged and given up on the hobby!:smile:

[canadianbudz604]

Ya try taking it out, it took my corals a couple months to get used to chemi pure.

[RMC]

Update. The Chemipure has been out of my DT for 3 months. My corals are alive but not opening up, aside from the flower pot coral that didn't make it. All of the corals are not opening up.
The fire and ice zoas have multiplied but have never opened completely.
I've moved them around in different light and flow conditions, left them alone for a couple of weeks then moved them again.
My levels are all in line
PH 8.0-8.3
Ca 470
KH 174
Mag 1350
Nitrate between 0.0-0.2
PO4 between 0.00-0.02

My live stock list:
1 black and white Orc clown
1 true Perc clown
1 fire shrimp
2 cleaner shrimp
6 blue legged hermits
3 snails

The shrimp don't go near the corals unless I'm target feeding the corals.
Any suggestions?

[RMC]

Zoa

[RMC]

Torch (sorry for the separate posts, I can only upload 1 at a time)

[Craigdillman]

Weird man only thing j can think of is lights ? What you running for lights they may be not enough power.

Because if your parameters are in check your waterchanges are in check and nothing is bugging the corals then only variable left is the lights? Or something is totally off? Say maybe a copper fitting somewhere or idk not sure man

Side note? You usint RODI water ?

[Craigdillman]

And having po4 below 0.04 is a stresser for corals not sure if thays enough for them not to open never got my levels that low and honestly I find it hard to believe that with just chemiclean (small amount of gfo) and not carbon dosing or biopellets your able to get them this low in a small tank

I'm inclined to thing the levels are much higher and your test kit is off, any algea anywhere else in tank?


Im stumped

[RMC]

Weird man only thing j can think of is lights ? What you running for lights they may be not enough power.
Because if your parameters are in check your waterchanges are in check and nothing is bugging the corals then only variable left is the lights? Or something is totally off? Say maybe a copper fitting somewhere or idk not sure man

Side note? You usint RODI water ?



I performed a 2 copper tests today, both came back 0.0 (Salifert). I'm using RSM 50/50 power compacts for my RSM 130, 1 bulb replaced 7 months ago and the other 4 months back.

And I'm using RODI, TDS measures 0.0 as well.

And having po4 below 0.04 is a stresser for corals not sure if thays enough for them not to open never got my levels that low and honestly I find it hard to believe that with just chemiclean (small amount of gfo) and not carbon dosing or biopellets your able to get them this low in a small tank

I'm inclined to thing the levels are much higher and your test kit is off, any algea anywhere else in tank?


Im stumped

I'm using a Hanna tester for my P04 tests. And I have been battling GHA for the past 4 months. About a mouth ago I added some chaeto to my surface skimmer cup to help battle the green hair algae. About 2 months ago I manually removed the algae with a tooth brush outside of the tank and it just keeps coming back.
I'm thinking it maybe the Live Rock I purchased used when I set up the tank 10 months ago.
I'm currently starting a new build, it'll be likely up and running in April/May. I will NOT use my current live rock. Instead I'm currently curing some dry rock (from Fujireefrock), which will be used in my new setup. Lesson learned!

[Baker]

When did you add the mp10?

[canadianbudz604]

I do see some hair algae in your pic. So it may be eating up nitrates/phosphates and ur tests will read 0, but it does seem like you have some algae troubles. What kind of water are you using (tap/Rodi)? What r u using to test your salinity?

[canadianbudz604]

I guess I don't type very fast

[Howie]

Do you siphon detritus out of the back? I had a rsm with all upgrades but I would still get a build up below the tunze and below my pumps.

[FishyFishy!]

I would try another nitrate or phosphate test kit. Maybe bring a water sample to your LFS. If you're battling hair algae, yet your tests are reading zero's, I would try different test kits to start.

Have you tested ammonia or nitrite?

[mikellini]

Hair algae can bother corals, both by touching them and by releasing chemicals into the water. My first thought was that your water is too clean. I would get the hair algae under control first and then decide what to do next. Using a phosphate binder and snails, along with manual removal, usually works quite well. If it's particularly resistant, try starting with a couple of days of lights out.

The chaeto will not out-compete hair algae for nutrients, so I'd remove that off the bat. Then run separate carbon and GFO or Phosguard, using the full recommended amount for your water volume. Add 2-3 turbo snails, continually place them on the hair algae so they keep eating it, and manually remove what you can. Continue to feed your tank/fish well to ensure trace amounts of phosphate and nitrate are available for corals. Once the hair algae is gone, test for nitrates and shoot for somewhere around 2-4ppm. Easiest way to achieve this is to feed more. Hope this helps.

[RMC]

I do see some hair algae in your pic. So it may be eating up nitrates/phosphates and ur tests will read 0, but it does seem like you have some algae troubles. What kind of water are you using (tap/Rodi)? What r u using to test your salinity?

Yes. It came back and I took a couple of hours today and removed as much as I could. Yes, I'm using RODI. Salinity is at 1.026, I calibrated my refractometer just prior to testing.

Do you siphon detritus out of the back? I had a rsm with all upgrades but I would still get a build up below the tunze and below my pumps.

I did this a couple of weeks ago. You're right, it gets rather funky back there!

I would try another nitrate or phosphate test kit. Maybe bring a water sample to your LFS. If you're battling hair algae, yet your tests are reading zero's, I would try different test kits to start.

Have you tested ammonia or nitrite?

Haven't tested nitrite for a few months. Ammonia test was 0.0

[RMC]

Hair algae can bother corals, both by touching them and by releasing chemicals into the water. My first thought was that your water is too clean. I would get the hair algae under control first and then decide what to do next. Using a phosphate binder and snails, along with manual removal, usually works quite well. If it's particularly resistant, try starting with a couple of days of lights out.

The chaeto will not out-compete hair algae for nutrients, so I'd remove that off the bat. Then run separate carbon and GFO or Phosguard, using the full recommended amount for your water volume. Add 2-3 turbo snails, continually place them on the hair algae so they keep eating it, and manually remove what you can. Continue to feed your tank/fish well to ensure trace amounts of phosphate and nitrate are available for corals. Once the hair algae is gone, test for nitrates and shoot for somewhere around 2-4ppm. Easiest way to achieve this is to feed more. Hope this helps.

I'm going to start the phosguard treatment tomorrow. Currently using Carbon. Is there any detriment to running the chaeto? I'd rather keep it in.
I'm in the habit of QTing everything (had a ich outbreak when I first started). The snails won't make it into my DT for 6 weeks. What can I feed them in the Qt during this period?

Thanks for the suggestions!

[mikellini]

I wouldn't bother with qt for turbo snails... If you're really paranoid, rinse them in new salt water. They can be sensitive to parameter changes tho.

If you're doing it right, the chaeto will wither and die with the hair algae, and just end up exhausting your phosguard faster. If you want to keep it, put it in your qt until the hair algae is gone, then return it and increase your phosphates a little by running less phosguard and changing it out less frequently.