To what extend do you think activists go to prove their point?

[mrhasan]

Well I came across a video on youtube which shows some fishermen showing how they use cyanide and speargun to catch ornamental fishes in phillipines for the aquarium trade. You got it! It's was shot by an activists group to show our hobby is ruining the world. Now the end of the video got my attention. Here's what the disclaimer of the video is:

The shot of cyanide fishing was staged. For this movie no animal nor environment was harm....

Now that got me into thinking, is our hobby "actually" threatening the ocean or does these sort of groups go to the extend of stomping on the reefs themselves to prove their point and get funds for further stomping?

Here's the video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtMs_6Z_jTE#t=410

And about our hobby killing the underwater ecosystem, this article will mesmerize you :)

http://www.livescience.com/42814-coral-reefs-thrives-acidic-waters.html

If you still think human can kill something so strong, I don't know what else nature can do to prove us wrong.....

[Slyguy00]

Im not sure where i saw it but there was a documentary about how finding nemo has seriously hurt the population of clown fish. Pretty scary stuff. If anybody else has seen it or know what its called i wouldnt mind knowing. And that first video is pretty brutal. Its good to let us all know what they do for our enjoyment.

[mrhasan]

Im not sure where i saw it but there was a documentary about how finding nemo has seriously hurt the population of clown fish. Pretty scary stuff. If anybody else has seen it or know what its called i wouldnt mind knowing.

Yah. To be honest, people took the movie in the wrong way. Finding nemo showed how a baby clownfish tried to escape from a tank and that inspired/motivated people to put clownfish in the tank without knowledge!

Can't wait to see people trying to acclimate regal tangs to a bucket of tap water :razz:

[Slyguy00]

Poor poor fish!

[IanWR]

I agree that staged images/video that is not clearly labeled as such is unnecessarily manipulative, and diminishes whatever point one is trying to make. As to "activists" staging things so they can get rich is nonsense. Petro-lobbyists use they same tactic to discredit researchers that publish studies that confirm anthropogenic climate change; that they are saying lies to gain access to the rich money available to the climate change lobby.

What is clear is that there isn't an issue that activists support that the big money is also behind. If there are people promoting moneyed interests they are called by the media think tanks, spokesmen, research fellows, etc.

The only way our hobby could be helping reefs is by monetizing reefs, to make sure people that live by reefs have a vested interest in preserving them. Eco-tourism, sustainable harvesting, creating protected marine parks, all of these can be part of the solution. Without controls and enforcement, if our hobby raises the value of reef fish it also encourages poaching. Unfortunately we have no way of knowing where and how our fish get to us.

Perhaps there could be an industry standard "sustainably sourced" label/logo that lfs could brag about using, or more can be made of having tank raised livestock, etc.

Personally I don't know where our hobby lies on the angle/devil spectrum but I hope closer to the former than the latter. Anything that can be done to move it in a positive direction should be considered, and let's not let shrill voices make us deaf to some possible salient points.

[soapy]

The business no doubt does some harm. But like Ian says it also does some good. Compared to fishing and farm/industrial runoff it is a tiny drop in the bucket. I have swam on reefs that were completely choked in algae. Excess nutrients combined with overfishing of large herbivores is bad news. By-catch from trawling is also really nasty especially the shrimping business.

Many of the fish caught for the trade are very fast breeders and I suspect will fill a territory in a hurry. Some better than others of course. Here is an interesting site to look at, compare these two fish on fishbase. Scroll down and pay attention to the ratings for resilience and vulnerability.

http://www.fishbase.gr/summary/6033

http://www.fishbase.org/summary/1257

[reefermadness]

I think its important to buy captive raised specimens (coral & fish) when ever possible.

thats all I have to add.

[Magickiwi]

I think its important to buy captive raised specimens (coral & fish) when ever possible.

thats all I have to add.

+1 This. It's not always possible but preferable. Having said that "activists" or lobbyists have entrenched views and neither party is able to see the bigger picture. Both sides of the issue have valid points, but when one position becomes so extreme (PETA) people lose interest in seeking a way to accommodate each other.

[soapy]

I think its important to buy captive raised specimens (coral & fish) when ever possible.

thats all I have to add.

That and go on fishbase and pick species with high fecundity.

[Dearth]

Bit of a rant then my answer which is tied into my rant

I have serious issues with those aligned with so called environmental groups, green groups and activist groups the vast majority of these groups go to the extreme to prove their points yet will rarely if ever show the other side of the issue and they have boatloads of people joining their causes without being properly informed and will often end up with egg on their faces once the reality of the situation comes out.

....................................

Now that being said my answer is that we as aquarists do have an impact on populations of fish and coral and rare species that much is true however in many areas where such things are collected are now somewhat to heavily regulated by those nations where these are collected. What is more damaging though are the locals, tourism and commercial trade those 3 alone do more damage than the aquarium trade. Just because the locals live there doesn't mean they are friendly to the environment and they can be quite destructive especially in the Asian countries where polluting is commonplace and laws are tough to enforce. Tourists love the colour and beauty of the ocean but few actually have an understanding of the fragility of a coral reef or how easily some species of fish get stressed out and will by ignorance or carelessness damage huge areas of coral communities. Commercial trade this is the extension of industrial needs into the ocean, building new resorts to fuel tourism, homes and of course fishing. All 3 of those are way more damaging than collecting for the home or commercial aquarists.

[Misses.ReefWars]

we do the same amount of damage as being reefers, as how the entire population pollute the oceans, i think in time, we will be the only ones whom conserve and breed these fish and invertebrates, corals and other ocean life forms, we will be saviors of dying breeds but who really knows, I think activist should concentrate on more important political and environmental issues so that the BIG picture is no dying oceans or reefers lol

[mrhasan]

Great insights :) And apparently, I can't disagree with any of the points :razz:

Yes, being in a hobby which is directly connected to the nature, it is our own responsibility to be vigilant about what we do and what we don't do in this hobby; not for the sake of activists but for the sake of nature.

It is just sad to see activists putting everything seem like an easy solution but simply "banning" it. I wonder how many solutions came from such groups rather than scientific findings. They always seem to pick up some broken pieces and connect the dots between those pieces according to what they want to highlight. Alongside, our side also has flaws like being tempted to buy fishes which only the most careful hobbyist can keep and lack of knowledge (yes! that's a big issue. I can confidently say that there's very few "new" hobbyist who would come over here in the first place to ask questions about what's right and what's wrong instead of going to a big box store and asking for everything that's needed to keep that nice cleaner wrasse).

In the end, what I think is the solution to sustainability is proper knowledge and being responsible hobbyist. Banning is not and never will the solution, there's always black markets for such occasions.

[mrhasan]

Here's an interesting video I found about fiji's coral recovery. The video shows how bad the coral bleaching and dying occurred during the beginning 2000s but recovered within a decade. I guess snorkel bob has outdated data :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHcsg3dnass#t=321

How can our hobby even put a dent into such resilient colonies of animals that have been inhibiting the earth for more than 400 million years!