400 Radiums & Blue Wave ballasts.

[Doug]

Hi all. I have started another thread on this topic, as the other is getting long winded and this one will also. :D There have been many questions on it, so as an owner of both products, here are some observations.

I was driving my 20K with my regular PFO ballast. I was looking at both the Blue Wave and Stephane,s excellent priced ballast to drive the bulbs or scrap them all together and go back to a lower "K". As Mike bought all my 175 watt 10K equipment, I decided to stick with them.

I purchased a 400 watt Blue Wave ballast from Jayson. Its one of the best & nicest looking ballasts I have owned. It does look, {outside only}, somewhat similar to my PFO. Has very nice features though. Long, good thick, quick dis-connect cables, lighted on/off switch and even an extra plug-in at the back.

I tried both the pendant and now the retrofit reflector. Both very nice units. I have settled on the reflector, as its behind a wall anyways. On a side note, anyone looking for a pendant to hang over their tank in a living room, that is one very nice unit, at an excellent price. { I have purchased others, so I can compare}.

Now, on to the important part. Here is all I have to compare with at the moment & what I propose. I would say its a fair bit brighter than running the bulb on a normal ballast. I only have one Radium bulb though.

I ran my 400 watt 20K and a 400 watt 12K, side by side, on a normal ballast. IMO, and thats what this is, smile.gif , there was no difference, NONE. When I now run the 12K on a normal ballast & the 20K on the Blue Wave, there is a large difference. Much brighter.

Of course I have no comparison with either the HQI or electronic ballasts. I wanted at least a year from the bulbs, and electronics are another story.

What I would like to do, is to get another 20K bulb and run it side-by-side. A normal PFO ballast & a Blue Wave ballast. Then we shall see. As my bulb is a month old, I would need the same for a comparison. I will ask Jayson if he has one. smile.gif

To me at least, I will run the ballast. Its a quality product, with a good warrenty. As a matter of fact, I was thinking about getting the duel instead and selling both my single Blue Wave & my PFO. Any takers. :D

On a side note, for those looking for my web page, I apologize. I have finished my contract with Homestead and am making a new page. It will reflect all the changes I have made recently. I only have the 170 now, no sandbed, tons of live rock, filtered only by a large ATS unit.

[ 16 August 2002, 06:24: Message edited by: Doug ]

[Aquattro]

DOug, from reading the Blue Wave homepage, it looks like the ballast can contain 1 of 3 diffeent ballasts. Which type do you have? Advance, magnatek or Venture?

[Bryan]

This is a e-mail I received from Sunlight Supply who puts together the bluewave ballasts. Looks like they recommend and use the Pulse Start for the Radiums. I left another e-mail with Perry on the use of a straight S51 400 watt HPS ballast vs a pulse start MH ballast. He seems to know his stuff.

-=Bryan=-

>>>>>>>>>
From an e-mail I received from Sunlight Supply, should help you decide.

>>>Hello Bryan,

Many people do in fact use the SON AGRO ballast for this lamp. It lights because it has an ignitor, being that it is a HPS ballast. There are some problems with this configuration. 1) it shortens lamp life. 2)It causes severe spectral shift in 5-8 months 3) radium says that overdriving the lamp by this much can actually cause the lamp to blow up (I wouldn't worry about that, I've never seen/heard of it happening before).

The fact is that the SON AGRO puts about 70 more watts through the lamp than should be. The Radium lamp is an 'energy saver' and is rated at 360watts. Radium Has said it will not warrant the lamp for the above stated reasons.

The m59 does burn more blue, and the firing is not always consistent.

What radium has told us to use is the m135 ballast. Its a 400w pulse start MH ballast. It does burn more blue than the HPS, but less so than the M59. So far it looks like burning with this ballast will add about 2-3 months to usable lamps life (this is just per a source, and should be verified).

We don't sell the SON AGRO for aquarium use because it is misleading, and has a higher inherent risk. The pulse start is the ballast we use for 400w pulse start lamps.

Regards,

Perry

>>>>>>>>>

[Doug]

Brad, its the magnetic. Thanks for posting that Bryan. I seen it on RC and was going to ask if you could post it on this thread. :D That basically sums up my reasoning for going with it. Plus knowing Perry, it has to be a top quality product.

[BC_Grl]

I just bought the dual Bluewave from Jayson. (Sorry Doug- Jayson said you wanted to buy another, but I emailed him to hold onto that one-whew!). Jayson said it is the "BlueWave 2" he sells. I am looking forward to getting my stuff from him.
All we'll need is sand & rock (along with other stuff) and then soon we'll be set. But first, all we'll need is the money to buy all of this! LOL :D
Brad warned me that this hobby was expensive before we bought a thing. But we have no regrets! We'll just take our time piecing it all together. smile.gif

[Bryan]

Additional e-mail from Perry on the correct ballast.

>>>Bryan,

Your assumption about the S51, and the radium is correct, more white than the MH, but easier on the lamp (inherently, also more blue) than the SON AGRO.

The pulse start and standard domestic ballasts have different open circuit voltages, push slightly different wattages, and therefore, different amp pull.

Radium has specifically said that the M135 is the best domestic ballast for this short lived lamp, and thats what I recommend, and how I base my recommendation.

Difference with the HPS, and PS_MH is the ignitor is different, and the HPS runs at a much lower open circuit voltage.

-Perry

-----Original Message-----
Subject: RE: Regarding ballast for Radium

Thanks for the reply Perry:

I am skeptical about the SON AGRO ballast as well. From looking at the specs the power factor is only around 80 and it draws over 5 amps, not very efficient.

I do have a question if you don't mind, I thought rhe only difference between a M59 and a M135 ballast was the ignitor in the M135 ballast. Otherwise the ballasts are more or less the same, if true how does this whiten up the bulb,or is there some other differences.

What about running the radium bulb with a 400 watt S51 HPS ballast. Would this burn the bulb whiter than the pulse start but easier on the bulb than a 430 watt SON AGRO.

While on the subject what is the difference between a HPS ballast and a Metal Halide pulse ballast.

Thanks

-=Bryan=-
>>>>>>>>

[Doug]

Ah-ha. Jeanna, thats why there was no more in stock. :(

Bryan, more good info. Thanks again.

[Jayson]

Doug, We have ordered more in we have a pallet of ballast and reflecters coming in this week. We are now the exclusive Canadian distributer for this product! The results and feed back comments are amazing! Let me know if you would like another one.

[Doug]

and what do I do with my single. :D

[Doug]

As I am asked about this, thought I had better post.

I did get a duel 400 Blue Wave. My tank looked great with the pair of 400 watt Radiums running. Perhaps one could even say, stunning.

However, when selling my equipment, the vho buyer liked them also. So I gave him his choice and he took the halides for his 120.

I did like them however and they were not sold because of any dislike. From pics I have seen, perhaps they were not as bright as with an electronic ballast or HQI, but they were very nice to me, and bright, far more so then my 400 12K, flanked by the 175watt 10K,s

[myinfo]

Hi:

I am new to this hobby. This may be a dumb question, under what scenerio you need a 400w MH. I currently have 1 90G with 4X48" VHO. I am thinking of upgrading it to MH. Should I use 2x250 or 2x400?
Currently I have no SPS. I plan to keep some SPS after the upgrade.

Thanks

[Aquattro]

Myinfo, probably start a new thread with that question with a "wish list" of future corals. Clams in the picture? Lots of rock or not? People run all kinds of lights on 2 foot tanks for all kinds of reasons. We need a better idea of what you want to keep.

[myinfo]

Thanks, I will copy this to a new post.

[Dez]

Doug, I just purchased the dual Blue Wave ballast from Jason, should be here next week. Can you tell me if you're running any other supplemental lighting with your radium bulbs? Is there a need for actinic lighting to supplement them? Do you use any other lighting for sun up/sun down? Thanks. I'm just planning to make my new canopy and wondering if I should include other lighting.

Thanks

Des

[Doug]

Hi Des;
I sold them, so I am speaking from the couple days I was running them.

First, I assume you ordered the 400,s plus 20K Radium bulbs. If so, you will love it. Man, its nice. As much as I like my 700 watts of vho, I just sit and stare at my friends 120, where my lights are.

No actinic supplements are needed. The tank colour is just a perfect bright blue/white. So you save on bulbs there, which help pay for the 20K,s.

In my friends tank, we put a pair of 40 watt Philips actinic bulbs, in his hood. Driven by one of those $50 electronic ballasts/with endcaps.

He uses it for evening viewing, after the halides are off. Run them until they calf, as they are only for you. His dont even come on, until just before the halides go off.

First, they are not needed in the morning, as
1. The halides are a softer start to light up, than actinics coming on full impact.
2. No sense running the extra wattage during the halide period, as you cant see them anyways.

Good luck with your new system. Let us know how you like it, or if you have anymore questions.

[Dez]

Hey, I never thought of that....that's a great idea to run the "supplemental-viewing pleasure-night lighting" to come on just before the halides come off. How long is your friend running the halides though? I only run my halides for about 6 hours a day and my other supplemental lighting is on for 12 hours. So I like to give my tank 12 total hours... Any thoughts?

Thanks Doug.

Des

[Delphinus]

Dez, if I could just jump in here for a second ... as far as I'm concerned, you may as well be getting yourself the holy grail of mogul socket halides. Unless heat or electricity costs are really running against you, my suggestion to you is run them for at least 10 hours. Give your tank an hour on each side for dusk and dawn if you want, and there's your 12 hours. Done deal. Or run them the full 12 hours. Your corals will LOVE you for it.

Seriously. You'll be amazed the results you get (unless you start overheating your tank, but, it sounds like you're well on your way to keeping that under control too).

I'm never going back to a 6 hour halide photoperiod (I ran mine that way for the first year I had halides). When I discovered an issue with my wiring with my fluorescents (the insulation had corroded off), I simply discontinued the fluorescents altogether and switched the halides to a full 12 hours. I originally fully intended to replace the wiring and go back to the way things were, except, that, things were so much happier under the halides for 12 hours that I simply kept things that way. As you know, my 50g and my 20g don't even have fluorescents, I just use the halides. I can only imagine how awesome things would be if I could afford the bluewave ballasts and the 400W radiums. That will be an upgrade for next year maybe, once I've gotten a fair shaked out of my iwasaki's.

Just my $0.02 ....

[Dez]

Thanks for the suggestion Tony. I might try that. I just sold all the lighting on top of my tank instead of taking apart the hamilton fixture and trying to fit it in a new canopy. That's what is affording my radiums and ballasts. I'm actually making money on this lighting switch...which will in turn buy my fans, and calcium reactor (I wish...he he)...it all goes back into the hobby anyway. Well, I guess I'll put it toward my electric bill eh? Thanks Tony.. by the way, I'm in Calgary now (again) for a wedding. I'll be hitting Wai's whenever they open...wanna join?

Des

[TimT]

I thought I would put in my two bits worth. I have several 400watt 20KK Radiums that I will be running with the Blueline E-Ballasts. They will be supplemental lighting in the greenhouse. Kinda like people using actinics for twilight :D

I will post some pics once they have burned in.

Cheers,
Tim

[Troy F]

Tim, is your greenhouse here in the Pacific Northwest? If so your radiums will be required to be more than actinics this winter.